Dating: When, Why, How, To Use No Contact

There are many dating rules out there, but it’s the tried and true ones, the old fashioned traditional ways of doing things, that really do work, which is why certain rules have held true and lasted over the years.

One of those rules happens to be the No Contact Rule. In this handy little guide, I’m going to explain to you the how, when and why’s of this rule: how to use no contact, when to use no contact and why to use no contact when dating. Because this handy little dating rule serves more than just one purpose and has more than just one use.

I’m going to be speaking to the ladies here, but men, this applies to you as well. But I don’t have to tell you that. You guys are well versed in this dating rule and put it to use regularly. But for those men who may not be familiar with it, read on.

When And Why To Use The No Contact Rule When Dating

When A Man Suddenly Disappears On You

No Contact is a handy little trick to attempt to lure someone back to you – by disappearing on THEM. As most women already know, powerful attraction builds for a man that suddenly, and without warning, disappears. Why? Because you begin to think about them constantly.

Where did he go? Is there someone else? Why did he disappear? It doesn’t matter if all the thinking taking place is actually negative in nature, it only matters that all that thinking is actually taking place.

Why?

Because when someone thinks about you constantly, it actually creates intense attraction for them. Playing hard to get works, ladies, which is why it’s another one of those good ole’ fashioned rules that’s stuck around. Psychologically, people tend to want what they can’t have. It’s called the Law of Scarcity and it works in economics and in relationships.

It’s a scientific fact – uncertainty heightens romantic attraction. So if you’re worried he’ll think you’re not interested and then be gone for good, don’t bother thinking that. That’s just your insecurities talking, that’s just you thinking you’re not good enough. But YOU ARE good enough. Have faith in yourself that you’re worth it – and that he thinks you are, too. Don’t sell yourself short because how you perceive yourself – is how others will perceive you as well.

You see, when he’s uncertain as to whether or not you really like him, it’s actually a good thing. It keeps him interested. It keeps him coming around. It makes him want to win you over. It makes him work harder at the relationship. All those things it does to you when it happens to you – it does to him as well.

When a man disappears on you and you worry that he may be gone for good - when he resurfaces suddenly, do you kick him to the curb? Nope. Well, it works the same for men, gals. When you disappear on them suddenly and without warning and then you resurface out of nowhere, they’re unlikely to kick you to the curb. Rather, nine times out of ten, the individual is thrilled you’ve returned.

Men know this, ladies. They use this dating rule regularly – on YOU.

When You Want Your Ex Back

This handy dandy little dating rule can also be used to lure an ex back into your tangled web. If you’ve overwhelmed your ex with neediness, emotional displays, tons of questions about his feelings for you, anger and frustration and, as a result, he dumped you and now you want him back - employ the rule of no contact immediately. Why? To make him think he was wrong about you - and to make him miss you.

Why?

Because men are human too, ladies. They miss people and they’ll miss you when you suddenly disappear and they’re ringing your phone and texting you and you’re not answering or responding to them. That’s when the roles gets reversed and now THEY’RE thinking about YOU constantly. And all that thinking, negative or not, is actually going to create an intense attraction for you. The point is to stay away so long that the man actually begins to “long” for you.

Men equate “longing” for someone with love, ladies.

To Get Over A Man

Yep, the no contact rule is truly a handy dandy little rule with lots of uses. And the last use is to help you get over a bad breakup with a man – to help you emotionally detach from him. Why do you want to detach from him? So you can move on, think about him less, and allow room to meet other men and cease the unhealthy obsessive thought patterns and embarrassing behavior that ultimately, only makes you feel worse about yourself and helpless.

Why?

You see, when you desperately hang on, when you remain in communication with an ex, you’re doing yourself a big injustice. You’ll never get over him if you’re still communicating with him. So do yourself a big ole’ favor here and stop doing that, right now.

If you want the pain to go away, ladies – you have to make HIM go away, because he IS your pain.

How To Use The No Contact Rule When Dating

When A Man Suddenly Disappears On You OR When You Want Your Ex Back

Generally, the no contact rule is a 30 day rule. How to do this is, when a guy suddenly disappears on you without warning or breaks up with you and you want him to notice you again, you get his attention by suddenly disappearing on HIM – you make him experience the consequences.

It’s what’s best for him and you. That’s how you learn lessons in life, that’s how you learn not to repeat your mistakes and that’s how you experience personal growth and develop coping skills. And yes, they call them “growing pains” for a reason – they hurt. So expect it to hurt and brace yourself for a wonderful period of self-awareness and personal growth.

You disappear for 30 days. You do not take his calls. You do not respond to his texts. You do not communicate with him via social media. You do not communicate or respond at all, period, for 30 days. You stay gone and all he hears are crickets chirping in the dead of night.

After not hearing from you or receiving a response from you for 30 days, he'll begin to think this . . watch the video below, a song called "Madness" by Muse, and pay close attention to what this man is doing in these lyrics here - he's THINKING - about the WOMAN, and what HE did WRONG and how he's now READY to face the fact that he needs to LOVE:

Some woman most likely pulled "no contact" on his ass there.

So then, after a 30 day time period (30 days from the time you decided to use the no contact rule) and lots of time for him to think, you suddenly and without warning – resurface. And you do so by either:

1.) Finally responding to a question from one of his last communications (if he’s asked one)

2.) Simply saying, “Hello, how are you?”

And when communication is reinstated – you keep it short and sweet. You don’t share your emotions, you don’t cry, you don’t text back and forth like lightening for 5 hours and you don’t have long, drawn out 3 hour telephone conversations in an attempt to hash things out. You play it cool. You’re busy, you’re independent, you’re confident and you have a life. You “check in” is all. You make small talk and nothing more.

And from that point forward, you play it cool. You take an hour or so to respond to texts. You return calls a day or so later. You don’t accept last minute date requests, he has to make plans with you 3 days in advance or – you’ve already made plans (even if you haven’t, you pretend as if you have – remember, you have a life and you want to give him the impression that you’re busy, healthy and others desire your time as well). This is how you set healthy boundaries, earn respect and get him to treat you with fairness and kindness.

If he’s started out after the no contact period correctly but then suddenly relapses into bad behavior again, then you employ “behavioral mirroring” with him. If he disappears on you for 3 days, you don’t respond for 3 days. If he takes 24 hours to answer a text, you take 24 hours to respond. If he says he’ll call and he doesn’t, when he does, you don’t answer it and you respond to it 3 to 5 days later. And if he really begins misbehaving and taking you for granted again – you employ the no contact rule all over again for 30 days. This is how you create fairness and balance in a relationship and how you hold your own and you don’t get plowed over again.

This is how you earn a man’s respect, ladies. If you’re a pushover, then that’s exactly what he’s going to do to you – push you over.

When You Need To Get Over A Man Or A Breakup

Breakups hurt, rejection hurts. And most times, they hurt women more than men because of all the emotions women are capable of having that men are not. Men don’t analyze things or beat themselves up. Men PROJECT their emotions – outward and onto others. Women ABSORB their emotions – and beat themselves up.

If you want the pain to go away, you need to walk through those emotions and accept the reality. The only way to get rid of the pain is to feel the pain, to work through it and to learn to cope with your emotions in a healthy manner. To make that process much easier for yourself, you employ the no contact rule.

You do not, under any circumstances, communicate with the man. If you do, you’ll have to experience the consequences of your OWN decisions here – you’ll experience pain again, because you’ve permitted it. So you ignore his calls, you don’t respond to his texts, you remove him from any of your social media profiles and you put the past in the past.

If you remain in contact with your ex, you’ll never heal and you’ll continue to experience the hurt. You must cease contact for your own good. If you want the pain to go away, get rid of the pain – he IS your pain - and you need to get rid of him.

This will help you to think of him less and less as the days go on. You will begin to detach from him and from all of the negative emotions and damaging thought processes. You will no longer feel the intense desire to cling to him or to reach out to him. You will begin to feel better about yourself and you will begin to make room in your life for a new man – one that treats you with respect and kindness.

Using the no contact rule to get over a man - helps you to actually get over him.

And there you have it, a handy dandy little guide to employing the no contact rule properly when dating. There are many times in life ladies, that you must learn to say “no” and actually take responsibility for your own happiness and stop blaming the man when it’s actually YOU permitting this unhappiness. If you want things to change – then YOU have to change. You have to learn to be happy, with or without a man, and you need to stop living under the false impression that you need a man to make you happy.

Your happiness doesn’t come from a man, it comes from within yourself - and you radiate it, like warm sunshine.

So get comfortable with the phrases below:

“No, I won’t tolerate this.”

“No, this is unacceptable.”

“No, I won’t permit you to treat me like this”

“No, I will not be available to you when you treat me with disrespect and take me for granted.”

It’s Simple Gals

If you don’t look out for yourself and treat yourself with respect, then why would anyone else? Men want sex. Women want romance. So the best (and only) way for a man to have sex with you – is to romance you. Period, case closed. It’s a tradeoff, and a fair and equal one at that.

So make them do that, ladies: No romance = no sex. It’s simple.

Learn to say “no” and set healthy boundaries in your relationships and you will actually find that you will begin to feel empowered. You will develop a healthy self-esteem. You will feel confident. You will signal to men that you need to be treated with respect. You will grow dignity. You will find that you worry less and less about impressing a man – and you become more and more focused on a man impressing YOU (romancing you).

You have something he wants (sex): Make him work for it (romance).

Do that and you will be happy. You will be treated with respect and kindness. Give it away for free and you’ll be taken for granted by a man who never wants to lift a finger for you or impress you or give you what you need (romance).

This is not game playing, ladies. This is setting healthy boundaries for yourself, looking out for yourself and earning respect for yourself – and making a man treat you with such.

And here’s the harsh reality, ladies. Recent studies have shown that the modern day woman kisses approximately 75 frogs before finding her Prince Charming. So realize that when you stand your ground and demand respect, lazy men, users, and players seeking sex for free will walk away from you. But that’s a good thing because you’re weeding your way through the worthless ones that would’ve only hurt you anyway.

So if 74 frogs leap away from you – realize that the 75th is on his way to you.

It’s the good ole’ fashioned way of doing things. Back in the day, they called it courting. Try it, it works.

2516 Comments:

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The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Jul 21, 2:42 PM,
"At the moment I am waiting to see if he contacts me, it's driving me crazy!"

Well, that's really all you can do. I mean, yea sure, you can start to pursue him, but if he's at a stage where he's uncertain or he's processing any feelings he may have or he just simply needs a bit of space - that will backfire and actually push him to make a decision that won't be in your favor most likely. Applying pressure rarely works in anyone's favor unfortunately.

Most men, a large majority of them, actually circle back if the woman remains confident, patient and carefree. Men like that quality in a woman, it signals emotional stability to them, and they watch for that. Which is a big reason why pursuing men often backfires (because it signals the woman is insecure and anxious).

Sit tight - don't say a word, don't reach out, and this one will be back, I'm fairly confident of that. It may take a few weeks, it may even take a month - but I think this one will be back. Particularly if you don't act as he's most likely expecting (anxious, insecure and worried). He'll think about that, see you as "different" and eventually. . .his curiosity will get the best of him and he'll be back.

And when that happens. . .make him sweat it out a little bit and don't jump on an immediate response. This will signal to him that you're a prize, you're in demand (others want your time as well), and if he's going to act like this and risk letting you go - you may or may NOT be available when he returns. And if he cares, he won't do this again anytime soon ;-)

Stand strong, be patient, be confident and in the meantime, keep moving forward with your life and enjoying time out with your friends. Never place your life on hold for a man, never make a man your entire life, and never make a man the center of your universe. . .until he actually makes that official by putting a ring on it ;-); July 21, 2015 at 5:24 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror, my long distance boyfriend and I broke up because he was disrespecting me. Flirting with other women on social media - women he's never met in person btw, (I'd love an article on social media from you also if you think it's a good topic), we had discussed it so he knew the boundaries.
He also seemed to lose interest in sex with me, only wanted to have "intelligent conversations" and no motivation to visit so we could actually have sex. He denied no longer being attracted to me, cited money issues as to what was stopping him from visiting.
Long story short, I straight up told him not to contact me when I broke it off. He has not. (But continued to flirt with the girls on social media who don't want him anyways.) We had been together 8 months with some time apart due to a previous break up. I left him then, but both break ups seemed mutual as I felt he had lost interest in me at that time too. That time it was not due to other women but "finding religion" which also led to him not wanting sex (until marriage, he changed his mind when he decided he wanted me back. He knew I was not happy with him concluding this is what religion instructed.)
We've been broken up about two weeks now. I don't want him back as I know I deserve better but I am hurt he didn't try to stop me from leaving and removed me from social media while continuing to "pursue" these women who live even farther away from me and don't want him.
Will my "no contact" work? Not entirely sure what I hope to accomplish beyond him regretting his poor treatment of me.; July 22, 2015 at 2:56 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Wed, Jul 22, 2:56 AM,
"Will my "no contact" work?"

It always works to help a woman get over a man and emotionally detach from him. And if you're asking if it'll make him regret his decision, only time will tell. It all depends on the individual man and his level of interest. There's no way to predict these things otherwise.

In the meantime however, try to view this as a blessing in disguise. Things don't work for a reason. And when they don't work twice - there's no point in attempting a 3rd go round, unless you want an exact repeat of the first 2 attempts.

And I think what you might not understand here is that this man appears insecure, particularly about sex or his sexual performance. He seems to be seeking out reasons/excuses not to have to go through with it - with anyone - and instead, he's seeking an ego boost. That's what the social media situation is providing him. He has absolutely no intention of getting together with these women, he's simply soaking up the ego stroke and good feelings about himself that this is providing him.

And if he is insecure as I suspect, that's the perfect venue for him if you think about it. He doesn't have to meet them, he doesn't have to impress them, he doesn't have to perform for them, he doesn't have to follow through with any physical acts. . .because it's all superficial. It makes him look "in demand" in the public eye, it provides an ego boost, it gives the false impression to others that he's a catch, and it provides a barrier to actual physical contact.

Someone shared this video years ago here and I've shared it tons since because it's that good - the message is THAT GOOD:

https://youtu.be/eQwB0EfveCA

Take 3 minutes out of your day to hear that message - in the long run, you'll eventually realize it's "truth" and it'll make you feel a lot better about this :-); July 22, 2015 at 8:34 AM
Anonymous said...: July 22 2:56 am
Yes, Mirror, watched and thank you. I don't believe he will be coming back, he lost interest in me.

Commenting again because you are very perceptive on the sex thing. He did have performance issues in that department. I recall him being concerned I was faking it once or twice. I wasn't. This could only be because he knows he lacks in performance. (ED)

And right again with his social media fantasy. A lot of things were just ego with him. It's hard to not react to ego.

I know I won't go back, not that I'm flattering myself he will seek me out, but a man not wanting to have sex with me who had a preference for the online illusion hurt my ego as well as my heart.

Thank you again Mirror.; July 22, 2015 at 10:33 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous July 22, 10:33AM,
"Commenting again because you are very perceptive on the sex thing. . .And right again with his social media fantasy."

Human behavior follows patterns, as humans we are all creatures of habit. And once you've unlocked the key to those patterns, you can easily begin to predict future behavior as well as decipher past behavior.

Which is why I was attempting to impart on you that - this is probably actually a blessing in disguise, you just don't realize it yet. Dating extremely insecure men, particularly those with existing performance issues, is no day at the beach. I've actually written about it here:

http://www.aphroditeastrology.com/2015/02/insecure-men-dating.html

Women who attach themselves to men like that for extended periods of time eventually experience EXACTLY what you are experiencing now "hurt my ego as well as my heart." Your confidence and self-esteem have been shaken, and you've been hurt. . .all because of HIS ISSUES, not yours. Don't take his "stuff" on as you own. Place it right back onto his shoulders where it belongs. Any woman he's with - he'd do this to. It's not you, it's HIM.

And I will tell you this. . .the insecure ones circle back around a LOT. You see, their fragile ego is like a beast that needs constantly "fed" by others, because insecure folks are empty inside. They derive their self-worth and happiness by latching onto others and sucking it from them like vampires. Eventually, they use up their resources and hit "dry spells" and when that happens, they circle back around to those from their past that once provided that "boost" for them. Which is why I say he'll probably be back. It might be a month or two from now, but he's going to have a "need" that he'll eventually reach out to you to seek fulfillment for (ego boost).

So be prepared - because social media is only going to go so far for him.; July 22, 2015 at 5:58 PM
loretta said...: I'm finally ready to use a week or two of NC with "Casual Guy." He and I are not dating anymore, but after we broke that off (he wanted to date other people after 10 months, and I said, "Fly, little bird!"), I wasn't able to go silent on him because we have been writing a screenplay together for a year, now.

It's almost done. I have so much rewriting and revising to do, that I could be working on it alone for awhile. Between that and work getting busier, classes I have to take, etc., I am thinking about going silent right now. Why? Because he has been such a jerk to me. I've put up with it for the sake of the project - and I have a ton of time and talent invested in this - but now that I don't need him in the immediate future to finish, I am going to disappear.

He knows he's a jerk. He's an alcoholic and he has had no significant relationships (and won't) since we stopped dating. He's gone through at least two recycled women from his past that didn't work out. I don't ask about it or tell him anything about my dating other men (which I do, a lot!). I can tell from the condition of his house and his person that he is spiraling downward again. Meanwhile, I treat him very, very well. I come prepared, I always look and smell nice, I make a lovely meal for us, and I work hard on the project while he has to do very little. He adds important content to the script, so I did need him for that. But now I don't.

We usually meet every Thursday. I just got back from visiting my daughter out of town for the past 5 days and he never once contacted me. He didn't respond to a cute picture I sent of my granddaughter, and he didn't respond to an email I sent him with a very funny video.

I am not going to tell him I'm back in town. I'm not going to do what I usually do, which is to organize the writing meeting, have everything rewritten and ready for review; I'm not going to prepare an agenda or a list of things we need to finish. I'm just going to stay silent. It might take him a day or two to realize I haven't reached out. When he emails or texts me, I'll ignore them. If he calls, I'll let it go to voice mail. It may concern him. It's not to "get him back" or "get over him" like most NC strategies. This is designed to show him that I am not going to let him take me for granted anymore. It's a way to try and balance the relationship again. Like the article MoA wrote about consequences, this is going to be a consequence.

I will remain off the radar until and if he figures out why I'm gone. He will have to have a "come to jesus" moment. He'll have to drive over here or leave me a message or write me a long email apologizing for being such a terrible work partner, someone who is indifferent to my needs in this work, someone who is entirely selfish and self-centered and does not appreciate what I have done for him. Instead of being a martyr, I'm going to sustain radio silence until he gets a clue.

Wish me luck. This could take awhile. LOL; July 22, 2015 at 7:55 PM
Hopeless Romantic said...: I dumped an insecure, narcissistic Taurus after a 3-month non-sexual fling. He told me during the "relationship" that he would never chase a girl. I think I did a number on his ego when I dumped him over text, and he still hasn't contacted me since then-- over a year and a half ago. Oh well, it's for the best :P; July 22, 2015 at 8:29 PM
Anonymous said...: @ Mirror: First of all, I think you and your site are totally awesome! :-) Will you elaborate on why some men are commitment phobics, please? I've dated a very nice man for over a year now. He's been very much a gentlemen to me and told me he loved me for the first time 5 months after dating. He's smart, successful, loving, committed, etc. I had a medical trauma at the end of 2014 and ended up in the hospital for 42 days and on life support for three and a half weeks. He came to visit me while in the hosp...several people told me. I was in a drug-induced comma so he could only sit there, as I could not reply to him. I was still very sick afterward coming home and he was still very attentive and caring, but I could tell that he was emotionally distance compared to pre-hospitalization. He later told me that he had never been through anything like that.
Anyway, I started to become a little insecure ( I was so weak physically, emotionally, mentally...as you can imagine after going through that.) and then got agitated with him. Four weeks ago he said he needed some space, which I have graciously given him with no contact at all. He did send me one casual email and then another casual text, but I have not contacted him nor him me again. I really care about this man, but he is 50 and never been married...even engaged. He said he thought 3 women he had dated over the years might lead to marriage but never did. He even mentioned once that he thought we would be a good fit for marriage. He also said that his mother (who is VERY sweet and kind) has never approved of any of the women he has introduced her to and there were only 3 or 4, myself included but I never asked him what her opinion is of me. I took her flowers the first time I met her and was very gracious and kind to her as she was to me. His father was very nice as well. I'm sad that he has not contacted me again and now feel that he has become commitment-phobic to me as well. I know there is nothing I can do (or want to do for that matter) and I will have to wait it out to see if he returns and the end result. Nevertheless, it hurts terribly and I'm hoping he will come around. He is nothing at all like the men described in these feeds, thank goodness. I think he would make a great husband as well. I wonder if he is subconsciously waiting for his mother to "approve" of someone. You would think that she would not want him to grow old alone and would want him to have a good woman at his side. He said he and his parents are not close but he respects them very much. I miss him so much and hope he will wise up and make things right again. What you are thoughts, Wise Woman that you are? WONDERING; July 23, 2015 at 1:03 PM
Anonymous said...: I recently had sex with a boy that I've been friends with for many many years. We've always teased each other and joked around and then earlier this year he asked me if I thought we could be more. Our texts and conversations heated up and we were talking daily. I anticipated that after we had sex he would likely "pull back" or cool off, and I was prepared to play it cool. We had sex a couple weeks ago, had some laughs about it, he sent some follow up texts, talked about the fun we had and how we should do it again. We were at a group gathering a week later and we pretty much ignored each other. If anything, I was a bit turned off at how arrogant he was behaving and flirting with just about every girl there. I just danced and had fun with my friends. The next day he came up to me and said something to me about not reminding him about something the day before. My response was "well, I didn't want to stumble over your ego." He gave me a surprised look, and asked me "Do you wanna talk about this?" Not wanting to fall into the trap of girls being emotional, saying too much, acting clingy, etc., I simply said "No," and he walked away. We didn't speak the rest of the day. I left without saying goodbye, no hug, nothing. I haven't texted him, he hasn't texted me. For a timeline, we had sex 12 days ago, his last text to me was a week ago, and my ego comment to him was four days ago. Here is my dilemma: I'm sticking to my guns and not texting him, but chances are we're going to be at the same place this weekend working together, and I know that we're definitely going to be working together next week. And I just don't know what to do and how to conduct myself when I'm around him. The articles here address how to ignore someone's texts and voice mails, but what do you do when you're going to physically be around them? I know that this early on I need to set boundaries, that it will set the tone for how he will treat me. I anticipated him pulling back because our friendship has crossed a new threshold and that's a lot for both of us to process. So am I on track here? I can't lie, I miss him so much, but I keep reminding myself of how dire the consequences could be if I reach out to him. I really need some solid advice here, ladies. Thank you. ~GiGi1970; July 24, 2015 at 2:03 AM
loretta said...: Surprisingly enough, Casual Guy must have seen the bat signal. He texted me first thing this morning asking if I was back in town. I was still in bed, so I ignored it. Then he called. I let it go. He left a message asking if we were writing tonight. I waited until mid afternoon to call him back. (That didn't last long, but I figured it was unprofessional for me to ignore that.) When I got back to him, he told me he had just gotten a big work project, and could we meet tomorrow or Monday? I said Monday was ok, probably. Not sure.

Then I told him I thought I could finish without him. That he took me for granted and didn't appreciate me and that I was tired of it. I said, "I can do this without you for awhile. Have a nice summer."

He told me I sounded like my mother. OUCH. That was both funny and sorta true. He explained very calmly that he would love nothing better than to write tonight, every night, every day if he could and that we had to set our egos aside, that it wasn't a personal rejection if he cancelled a meeting with me. I told him it was very personal, if he couldn't manage one night a week on this. We went back and forth, but I could understand his point of view, and I think I was probably reacting from some stressful situations. I did take it out on him, but he's pretty good at taking it when I get riled up about it. He works alone, and he has been busy, and I realized I was expecting something from him that just isn't possible.

We have a very weird relationship. I am probably his best friend, and he is probably one of the very few men in my life (of about maybe 3) that really understands me, and someone with whom I can be my real self, and who can be real with me, or as real as he can. He wasn't blowing me off to go out with whatserface, and he does have his drinking to do, of course. I say that jokingly, but it's true. He insisted he's committed to the project, that we have great work to do, and that he loves me, loves the movie, loves the dog I gave him.

He texted me at around 11 pm, so I know he was home, probably wondering where I was. I was out and about, we joked around a little. I can't stay mad at him. He is what he is.

Now, there is a good guy in the picture that I like a lot and hope things move forward. I'm refraining from being eager or contacting him. I'll be patient. He (New Guy) will be in touch sooner or later.; July 24, 2015 at 2:50 AM
Gem50 said...: @Loretta
Your post supports what MsMirror has been telling us: when a woman voices her unhappiness of a man's behavior, he hears "mother." In this case its not HIS mother, but oh boy!
Good luck with new guy; July 24, 2015 at 10:58 AM
Anonymous said...: 'Sit tight - don't say a word, don't reach out, and this one will be back, I'm fairly confident of that. It may take a few weeks, it may even take a month - but I think this one will be back.' The Mirror of Aphrodite- you were right!! So the guy messaged me on whatsapp last night (I resisted didn't look or reply until this evening). He just said 'No idea what these mean. I have a new phone. woooo' (this refers to messages I sent when his phone broke and so has only now just seen). I'm a bit miffed he hasn't explained his absence, obviously his phone was broken or asked how I've been etc but maybe he doesn't think he hasn't done anything wrong?! I've recently moved to the same city as this guy and was hoping to see more of him (I was having to commute to work and meeting him for dates after the working day). I just replied saying 'wooo welcome back!' I know it's hard to judge on one message but still think he's not that keen. Trying not to overthink or get paranoid! I guess my response now gives him the chance to strike up a conversation? Argh hate this!; July 24, 2015 at 1:52 PM
Anonymous said...: Hello , MOA! I really like you're NC approach and it has been working so far (iplemented for short periods) .I would like to ask you about the use of social media while trying to go MIA . For instance ,i like to update regulalry my instagram acc ,does it trigger the dissapearing act?? Because it allows the man i am trying to use NC with, to see what I am doing and , while he is not very consistent texting me , he is "liking" every pic, which i find very childish. Should i dissapear completely from instagram to make it more efficient , or is it irrelevant ??? In my opinion he is checking it regularly to keep an eye on me .; July 25, 2015 at 2:27 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Jul 23, 1:03 PM,,
"Will you elaborate on why some men are commitment phobics, please?"

There are many reasons this happens to men and women both. Past traumas, abandonment, neglect, stage of life, preference towards single life - to just name a few. But I will say, you see this more often in men versus women because biologically, men are programmed in general to believe that commitment is not good for them. And the biological reason for that is - procreation of the species. Men are wired to prefer "variety" versus "commitment" because if they weren't. . .the human species could be put at risk. Mother Nature requires that genes are mixed and multiplied, so she's programmed men with more of a desire for variety (to ensure the gene pool remains fresh and the species lives on).

"What you are thoughts,"

I think he's proceeding at a normal, healthy pace ("told me he loved me for the first time 5 months after dating"), and chances are, he's experiencing a moment of withdraw from the emotions that have surfaced (within the relationship and also from the health experience) - which is very normal, particularly for men because they need to pull away in order to process feelings and truly "feel" them, versus women generally who "feel" during times of togetherness. It's one of the big reasons men ask for "space." They're not necessarily running away from you when they make that request, they're generally attempting to get the space they need in order to "check in" with themselves about how they truly feel.

If a man takes space and during that time he misses you, he longs for you (men equate longing with love), his thoughts are preoccupied with you, he wonders where you're at, what you're doing. . .if he "feels" all that during the time away, he'll be back. And when he returns, he's now very sure of his feelings. He knows, because he took time to "check in" with himself.

And if a man takes space and he doesn't experience those things mentioned above, chances are he'll fade away. And while that's a painful experience for a woman to endure, or anyone for that matter, the reality is that it's truly a blessing. Everyone deserves to be loved and if the person you're with isn't in love with you, then it's not a match and you don't need to be there anyway and this person has just saved you a ton of heartache, aggravation, self-doubt and sleepless nights.

I think this one's "checking in" with himself. He's probably experienced more emotions in the last several months than he's experienced in the last 5 years of his life. It's overwhelming for anyone, but it's particularly overwhelming for men because they don't live in the heightened emotional state that women do generally speaking. So all these emotions aren't something he's probably comfortable with or extremely well versed in dealing with and he probably just needs some time level off.

I'd stay silent, give him the space he needs, and see if he returns to you. If he cares, he will. If he doesn't feel strongly, then he won't. And if that should happen, which I don't think is the case, but if it does, don't beat yourself up over it. It will actually be a blessing in disguise. As the days pass, chances are if he doesn't hear from you, he'll wonder more and more about you, his curiosity will get the best of him - and you'll hear from him again. And in the meantime, you get to process how you feel about all of this and to see if, when he returns, YOU still feel the same. So take advantage of this time for yourself as well. And spend some time enjoying yourself, pampering yourself, maybe sprucing up your wardrobe, hairstyle - or whatever floats your boat, makes you happy and makes you feel good about yourself.

Cont. . .; July 25, 2015 at 5:04 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: That way - when he returns, you look like a million bucks, you feel like a million bucks, he's impressed with how confident and independent you are and how you didn't come unglued during this time and instead, you came out swinging ;-)

And if he doesn't return - then the next time he sees you, he's gonna' kick himself in the ass and wonder how/why he could've let you go - either way, it's a win-win ;-); July 25, 2015 at 5:04 PM
Anonymous said...: @Mirror. Your insight regarding relationships is incredible! You're right--either way it's a win-win. I have peace. Thank you for replying. :-) July 25, 2015 at 5:04 PM; July 25, 2015 at 11:05 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Jul 25, 2:27 PM,
"Should i disappear completely from instagram to make it more efficient"

That's up to you, but if you feel he's keeping a close eye there, then disappearing from the site will most likely catch his attention and leave him wondering ;-); July 26, 2015 at 12:48 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @GiGi1970,
"what do you do when you're going to physically be around them?"

You don't change a thing about your behavior and you carry on as you normally would, giving very little if any of your attention to the individual at all.

Because here's the thing - he's running a bit of "game" on you. You may not realize it, but his response to your comment was actually VERY telling. It really shed light on what he was doing there. He did not respond with, "What's that supposed to mean?" Or, "What do you mean, I don't understand?"

Instead he responded with "Do you wanna' talk about this?" HE KNEW EXACTLY WHAT YOU MEANT, which is why he didn't question it. And he knew exactly what you meant, because he KNEW EXACTLY WHAT HE WAS DOING there. It was intentional. His behaviors and actions that night were intentional.

So what was his intention? His intention was to trigger your insecurities so he could garner a response from you, because your response would tell him a lot.

If you respond with jealousy, he knows you care. If you respond with anger, he knows you care. If you respond with heavy emotions, he knows you care. See where this is going? His behavior that night was all geared towards triggering a response from you, because your response was going to tell him something. Immature men won't ask you how you feel. Instead, a lot of them will pull a silly stunt like this that's meant to trigger a reaction from you to find that out instead. And then they manipulate the situation and make it like YOU are the one with an "issue" because you reacted - when in reality, THEY are the ones that truly have the issue.

And their issue is that they're emotionally immature, a bit insecure, and they're seeking "validation" of themselves and their worth based on your response to their little stunt.

So in a nutshell, what this all tells you is that:

1) He's emotionally immature.
2) He's a bit insecure.
3) Because of that insecurity, he now needs validation of his worth.
4) And because he's emotionally immature, he can't ask for that, so he pulled a stunt meant to trigger a reaction that would provide that to him instead.
5) When he didn't receive the reaction he expected (which was for you to come unglued and unravel right in front of his eyes, begging and pleading for more of his attention), he pretty much in a round about way flat out then ASKED you for that validation when he responded with "Do you want to talk about this?"

Translation: "Do you really like me? I'm feeling very insecure and I'm not sure you like me. I need a lot of attention right now, and I need to know if you think I'm great."

And while you may be tempted to jump right into that and tell him you think he's great, he shouldn't worry, blah, blah, blah. . .do NOT do that. Do NOT feed his insecurities by validating them for him right now. Because if you do that, and he knows he's "got you" right where he wants you, he could turn on you because he is emotionally immature and he could begin to take you for granted. So DON'T do that for him. He's already resorting to playing games here, so we already know he's capable of that and we don't want to give him any excuse to go full throttle with more of it.

Cont. . .; July 26, 2015 at 1:43 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: If his bad behavior is REWARDED with more of your attention and affection - then that tells him that every time he feels insecure and needs validation and attention. . .all he had to do is pull a stunt and yank your chains. And you don't want to start a pattern of that because being in a relationship with a man who is constantly yanking your chains and pushing your emotional buttons is miserable and soon turns into a strange co-dependent relationship. He'll become dependent on you to constantly feed his fragile ego through childish stunts, and you could become "addicted" to him in a way because you'll begin to feel obligated to "fix" him. So don't let that toxic cycle begin here.

Instead, leave him be to work out his own issues. Carry on with your life as if it's business as usual, don't react emotionally, don't react with anger - don't react at all when he pulls these stunts. If he doesn't get the reaction he's expecting, then he may "up his game" and come at you "straight" like an adult instead of a child pulling stunts to receive attention and validation when they need it ;-); July 26, 2015 at 1:44 PM
Anonymous said...: I have experienced what mirror talks about in the post July 26, 1:43 and 1:44, the acting out immature men tend to do to get reassurance. While some might disagree and I do understand men do have feelings and deserve a boost now and then (if they have shown to be mature, deserving men) it is the man's job to take care of us, not the other way around. When you reverse it with an immature man, you get more bad behavior. Been there, done that. (wish I hadn't) Great website; July 27, 2015 at 1:43 AM
Anonymous said...: MOA I need your help! I'm commenting again - 3 month guy/ phone broke/ hardly any contact from him. So this guy I've been seeing for three months hasn't messaged me since telling me he had got a new phone- see previous message above (very short and no questions asking how I've been, despite the fact I've literally moved down to the city where he lives for work reasons). I was the last person to message and I know you shouldn't double message or pursue the guy but I so want to clarify what is going on! I also don't want to give him the 'easy route out' by allowing him to just not contact me and give no explanation. My Dad (wise guy) thinks I should let him message as the guy knows I'm interested and he knows it's his turn to message whereas my sisters think I should send a message saying something like 'Hey I feel like this is fizzing out, what do you think?' to try and gauge his thoughts... but not really feeling that! I have this guy on facebook as well as two of his close friends (who all added me) and I can see updates from things they've done, photos etc. I know he has a busy social life but it just seems like he's just suddenly forgotten about me. Neither of us have ever been in a relationship before (we're both mid-20s) so don't know if he's got the 3 month itch?; July 27, 2015 at 9:00 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Jul 27, 9:00 AM,
"Neither of us have ever been in a relationship before (we're both mid-20s) so don't know if he's got the 3 month itch?"

Has he agreed to enter into a committed relationship by asking you for one? Because if he hasn't asked for that, you're not actually in a relationship with him. . .you're only dating him. You can't assume that since you've been dating him for 3 months that this is a committed relationship, ya' know? He has to want that as well, he has to ask you for it and in doing so, agrees to enter into one.

"My Dad (wise guy) thinks I should let him message as the guy knows I'm interested and he knows it's his turn to message"

Absolutely, 100% agree with your father here.

The only way a woman can know if a man is genuinely interested or not - is to see if HE pursues HER. Your father knows this, knows how the male mind works, and he's attempting to pass that knowledge on to you with his advice - so that you don't pursue the man and then have to suffer possible rejection and get hurt. Your father knows that the natural order of things is for the man to take the masculine role (lead and initiate) and for you to take the feminine role (submit if you choose).

"my sisters think I should send a message saying something like 'Hey I feel like this is fizzing out, what do you think?' to try and gauge his thoughts"

This is completely unnecessary - an individuals actions (or lack thereof) ALWAYS tell you what you need to know. It's not necessary to hear it when you can already see it (in their actions or lack thereof).

Additionally, and I don't think a lot of women realize this, but this type of behavior actually signals insecurity. It signals that you're at home, feeling bad about yourself, bad about the situation, worried and anxious - and reaching out for reassurance and validation. Because again, why ask when the actions (or lack thereof) are already telling you everything you need to know, ya' know? It'll just make you look bad and men equate this to emotional weakness. It's not an impression you want to give a man, or anyone for that matter, at all.

Instead, the impression you want to give is that you've hardly noticed his absence because your life is so full and so many others are demanding your time as well - because you're a real catch, you're well-liked, you're in demand, and you're not the type to sit around waiting on a man. You're out there setting the world on fire and if he wants to be a part of that. . .he can try to catch up to you because you're on fire ;-)

Men like confidence, they're attracted to it. And what I've just referenced there above is how a confident woman carries herself. Men are not attracted to what they perceive as emotional weakness and insecurity, nor is anyone really attracted to that. So you never want to signal that you're struggling emotionally with the absence and you're anxious and worried and now you're pressuring and questioning as a result, to make yourself feel better.

Cont. . .; July 27, 2015 at 10:53 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: Confident women don't care if a man circles around again. . .because their happiness in life doesn't depend on the MAN, or a man, being in their life. Their life is already "full" whether a man is in it or not. Get where I'm gong with this? It's an attitude, a mindset - and men are attracted to that like wildfire. If they think you're a catch and they think a lot of others want your time as well. . .they'll "compete" to receive some of it - and we all know how much men love competition (hence their love of sports ;-) And if the man doesn't compete, then you have your answer, and it's not necessary to ask the status of the situation.

Besides, doing what your sisters are suggestion actually only causes more grief. Think about it. How many times have women posed these types of questions to men and received the response they were hoping for? Very few, I can assure you of that as I read those types of stories submitted here daily. It's a pointless effort and honestly, it only gives the man an opportunity to lie to you and string you along.

Always IGNORE WORDS - talk is cheap. Focus on ACTIONS (or lack thereof) if you really want the TRUTH. And listen to you dad. . .father knows best ;-); July 27, 2015 at 10:53 AM
Anonymous said...: "Has he agreed to enter into a committed relationship by asking you for one?" Nope, just think it may have been heading in that direction and is possibly the reason why he's gone quiet on me, indicating he's not ready for it. 3 months is the longest I've ever dated someone and him too I think..
"And listen to you dad. . .father knows best ;-)" Thank you, will follow your advice too and wait it out, if the guy doesn't contact me, I've got my answer.; July 27, 2015 at 11:12 AM
Anonymous said...: @Anonymous July 27 2015 1:43 AM "When you reverse it with an immature man, you get more bad behavior." Are you saying that when you do No Contact, MIA, etc., as suggested by Mirror that an immature man gets even worse? Yikes!; July 27, 2015 at 4:26 PM
Anonymous said...: MOA, thank you for your very insightful response to my inquiry. I am extremely grateful to you for the solid advice you gave me. I've read and re-read your article about insecure men, and sadly I see shades of my friend in there. I'm crushed that someone I've been friends with for so long would run a game on me after all these years, just can't believe it. I wasn't looking for a marriage proposal or anything, it was just kind of exciting that our friendship was going in a new direction and now I see that I've been had. Ouch. There is still zero communication between us, and I'm not going to reach out to him. Just don't understand why he would gamble away years of friendship for a quick roll in the hay. I would never have crossed that line with him if I thought it would play out like this. It just doesn't make sense. You mentioned "If he doesn't get the reaction he's expecting, then he may up his game and come at you straight like an adult instead of a child pulling stunts to receive attention and validation when they need it". I don't know if I'd recognize this if it happened; would you mind clarifying this for me? You've been so eloquent with your words, and I apologize for asking for a better explanation, but I almost took the bait when he said "do you want to talk about this?" Thank you again... ~GiGi1970; July 27, 2015 at 5:06 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA!

I met this guy online. For the first two weeks when I was out of town we texted and he was keeping a steady communication.

When I got back to town for a few days we went on a first and second date with one day gap (he wanted to see me every day but I told him I can't because I'm very busy at this point in time). He was very enthusiastic to get to know me and very affectionate with holding hands and kissing by the end of the first date. I liked him too but needed time to see how much. On both dates I avoided holding hands and got to the point where he would search for my hand and I would hold onto his arm to avoid the hand holding. On the second date he asked me about my relationship history and then I mirrored the question without the conversation ending somewhere. He asked whether I'd ever had a boyfriend because I seem very shy. I said 'of course! I'm 26.'

Cont...; July 28, 2015 at 8:52 AM
Anonymous said...: Cont...

I admit that I tried to keep the conversation light while he was trying to keep it serious. Then we talked about lighter subjects and at some point I brought star signs up and he got annoyed. He said this isn't consistent with my rational approach to things etc and told me how he hates labeling. I was surprised by this strong reaction and told him it's just à bit of fun, an ice breaker of sorts. Then I asked him if he got annoyed and he joked around and said no.

When the date ended he was being cute again and hugging me to keep me warm and holding my hand and he kept saying I must be very shy because I kept giggling because it's only the second date and I felt like he was being too romantic too fast. I played along as the shy girl but then it got tiring. We kissed goodbye and he wished me a good journey for my three-week trip the next day. That night I thought about the whole cute shy girl thing and it irritated me as it's untrue and I texted him to tell him in a playful way that I'm not reallyy that shy and goodnight. He replied the next morning telling me that I really confuse him sometimes and sent me a smiley with a kiss.

I'm abroad now and it's one day later. I do like this guy enough to continue to get to know him but I'm concerned because he hasn't texted anything yet and judging by his enthusiasm this is quite cold for him. I expected he would wish me a good time on the trip or send me a text to see how I am... He was acting like a boyfriend on the dates and we have been texting every day for the last two weeks so now this seems strange. I worry that he might think I don't like him enough and maybe I need to initiate? Or maybe he decided he doesn't like me because of the star sign conversation? Should I contact him soon?

Sara; July 28, 2015 at 8:54 AM
Anonymous said...: @ Mirror:

I have another question based on your reply "I'd stay silent, give him the space he needs, and see if he returns to you. If he cares, he will. If he doesn't feel strongly, then he won't. And if that should happen, which I don't think is the case, but if it does, don't beat yourself up over it. It will actually be a blessing in disguise."

"WHICH I DON'T THINK IS THE CASE"

I'm curious as to what makes you say this. I'm certainly hoping this is the case as well! We haven't spoken in 32 days and haven't seen each other in 6 weeks. It seems like such a long time when your heart is hurting. :( It definitely causes insecurity when the days continue to pass and he hasn't initiated contact. And...it does cause a woman to wonder "Has he met someone else?" "Has he forgotten about me?" etc. I just love your advice/comments/wisdom! :) WONDERING; July 28, 2015 at 9:54 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @GiGi1970,
"If he doesn't get the reaction he's expecting, then he may up his game and come at you straight like an adult instead of a child pulling stunts to receive attention and validation when they need it". I don't know if I'd recognize this if it happened; would you mind clarifying this for me?"

What I mean by that is that if he straightens up and starts acting like an adult rather than a child, he will not pull stunts and play games meant to trigger your insecurities to receive the attention/validation he needs. Instead, he will come to you as a gentlemen would (and not as a child acting out). He would come to you in a serious tone and manner and he would either initiate a conversation with you, or invite you to have one, about whatever is on his mind.

In otherwords, he wouldn't play childish games and then manipulate the situation onto you by making it appear that YOU need to talk about something that's bothering YOU (something that he's triggered by playing games). He would instead be honest about the fact that HE needs to talk, and he would either initiate that conversation himself from a place of honesty, or he would signal to you that HE needs to talk in a genuine manner. He would not try to flip it onto you by making it appear that something is bothering YOU. He would be honest about the fact that something is bothering HIM, and he needs to talk about it.

That requires him to be vulnerable (susceptible to emotional pain), but nonetheless, he'd be willing to do that and he'd be an adult and he'd be honest and admit that HE is the one in need. (Instead of manipulating it to make it look like YOU are the one in need.); July 28, 2015 at 10:45 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Jul 28, 9:54 AM,
"I'm curious as to what makes you say this."

Because the reality is that most men DO RETURN if given enough "silence" and space to do so. Particularly if the pair dated for a while and things were left hanging as unfinished business. About a year or so ago, I posed a question to the women of this community and asked them to think of all the men they've dated - once, twice, for months and for years - and to write down the number of them that returned at some point in time.

To the surprise of many (because a lot of women don't actually stop to think about how much power women actually have over men), the percentage of men that returned was high - VERY high. If I remember correctly, it was about 91% or 92% that eventually returned. And these returns ran the gammut of taking anywhere from one month, to 3 months, to 6 months to a year or more - some women hearing from these men years later. The number of men who were actually never heard from ever again was less than 10%.

So I believe that the way he somewhat left this hanging, and the fact that you had dated for a while, and the fact that he's not hearing a word from you. . .will eventually cause him to become curious and eventually, in some form or fashion, reach out to touch base.

But the thing you have to remember is that when this happens, it does NOT automatically mean the man wants a relationship. You have to be careful with these types because a lot of the time, when they return, it's only for casual purposes (and to receive sex). So you do still have to keep things in perspective, keep your feet on the ground firmly planted in "reality," and not get swept up in emotional "fantasy" - and keep it real, without any expectations, so as to not get hurt.; July 28, 2015 at 10:55 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA... I have commented here twice before, but I never heard from you. Today, my cancer guy told me he was done. It's been an emotional roller coaster. We were high school sweet hearts that re united after 10 years. We made plans for a life together. We live in different states but I recently moved back to his state to try to build our relationship. He neglected me so I moved back home. We have been back in each others lives for a year. He used to not be able to go a day w/o talking to me. Now it doesn't matter if he hears from me at all. Today when I brought this up, he told me that I dealt with it for 10 years and that I should be able to deal with it now. But if ever I am not available to him, he will call and hound me until I become available. He is not fair in his treatment. For the last month I've told him that we are slipping away but he denied it. Just last week I asked if we should take some time apart, he said no. But today when I asked what we were doing (because we've not really been in communication) he said that maybe I should take some time to figure it out. It's as if he was trying to put everything on me, like he was looking for a way out but didn't want to be the bad guy. I have been emotional the last few months but it's because of his behavior. I used to be his world but now I am nothing to him. It hurt and today he finally left. I asked if things were over today and he would respond by saying something like, well if that's what you need me to say then ok, or if that's what you need to hear, etc etc. Then I told him to stop and just be there for me. Then eventually it led to him finally saying that he was done. That it was over. I hate for things to end and I hate for them to end why I am not at my best. The last time he saw me, 2 weeks ago, I had gained 15 pounds. Then our last conversations have been emotional. Why would he ever come back if his last memories of me are so horrible...?

Will you please help me? I don't know what to do. I don't understand why it was so hard for him to love me. I did everything right. How can he not see his wrong doing? What scares me the most is that we're not kids anymore. One of the things he always said after we reunited was that he's always wondered what it would've been like to be with me. Now, after all this time, he sees that I'm emotionally unstable and he'll never come back to me will he? He sees what bullet he's dodged and he'll never want me again. My emotionally neediness and clingy behavior has caused me the one person I've ever really loved. I hate that I am overly emotional. I hate that about myself. I don't know what to do.

Pisces; July 28, 2015 at 3:13 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Ms. Mirror,

I stumbled on your site when I was trying to understand why my ex bf could go back on Match two weeks after I broke up with him. I was so hurt and heart broken even though I was the one who dumped him. Your insights really empowered me. I feel so much stronger because of your wisdom. Thank you for great articles! I am on NC now but would like to seek your advice to see if I should give him a second chance.

I am in mid 40's and he is in early 50's, both have great life and job. He was divorced eight years ago and had two serious relationships of 6 months and 18 months before ours. I had a terrible divorce after 17 years of marriage. I gave myself two years to grieve and heal before I went out dating. He was my first bf and sex partner after my divorce. I met him last August and we connected immediately. We have deep connections and both have similar views of life from our experience and our spiritual interest. He is sweet, gentle, calm, smart, well versed. Never raised voice to me, always said sweet things. Both of us were open to each other about what we want and don't want. I let him chase and one month after we met I agreed to be exclusive but did not agree to sex until we became boy friend/girl friend 3 months later. Four or five months after we met, we started talking about marriage. He has always said I am his dream girl and wanted to marry me. He had never had that thought with anyone else after his divorce. He said I am smart, sweet, beautiful, sensual, dainty, strong, mature, calm, independent, high EQ, get him completely…

We had a huge fight two months after we met when he provided misleading information about his one of his past girlfriends. I don't mind the history but honesty and integrity are my core values so I did not appreciate distorted information. During the fight, he said twice along the same line that he wanted to help me resolve my concern but wanted to make sure he was ok out of it, and that he wanted to make sure his needs were OK while helping me sort out my issue. We worked out the conflict eventually after several serious talks but those words stuck in my mind that his needs came first even when he did something wrong.

cont.; July 28, 2015 at 6:06 PM
Anonymous said...: We got along very well otherwise. Everything was so easy and smooth. Even when we fought a couple of times, both of us acted mature, calm and respectful. He almost always initiated text, call or date. We usually texted during the day and had phone chats after 10 p.m. when we finished with our kids. However due to our hectic work schedule and custody schedule, we usually were able to meet once on Monday and alternative weekend. So text during the day and phone call in the evening were important to us to stay connected. But then something started to bug me. It happened almost like a monthly cycle that he ignored me for a whole day or two or a few without a text or a phone call. Sometimes he was busy and sometimes he was not. Talked to him a few times that I like to stay connected and was upset when we could not. He said he was OK and felt connected when we did not text/call. I told him I was not OK. After those talks, he would make effort at first then felt back to the old pattern again. I usually let it go after I voiced my concern. No consequence…right? Gradually I became unhappy that he did not show he cared about how I felt.

Other things started to show up as well, like he promised me to do something then did not follow through (like five or six times), and he did not make as much effort in the relationship as before. I am a very independent woman so I did not make a big deal out of it. Now after reading your blog, realized what a big mistake. So he started to take me for granted and became lazy in planning dates or showing care to me. When he was sick, I went out of my way to take care of him but he was more concerned about himself. When he lost his job last October, I supported him and listened to him talk almost every day. Usually he could also listen to me, then one time when I was upset with my ex-husband and vented to him during our nightly chat, he cut me off. Though he apologized for being rude the next day when I shared my upset feeling, he did not really think it was a good timing for him to listen cos he was on a biz trip. I felt totally unsupported and started to think he is selfish.

Cont.; July 28, 2015 at 6:07 PM
Anonymous said...: In the money department, he makes very good money and joked once that I got myself a sugar daddy. That was a mighty expectation that was not measured up by actions though, not that I was expecting a sugar daddy you know. I have a great career and make a good living myself so I stated to him that it was icing on a cake. Still prefer a guy who can provide and show masculine energy in a relationship. He usually paid our meals when we dined out but I invited him over for dinner to my home more times. Sometimes I paid our dates too. He bought me flowers a few times and some gifts at Christmas and Valentines. He took me to a couple of weekend beach vacations. In April this year, he took me to Paris for a week. He paid the trip but I knew if I had offered to pay my share, he would have been very happy to take it. Overall, he was generous but I saw a stark contrast between his spending on himself and me. I don’t want to sound ungrateful for what he did for me but I could not help thinking how important I was to him if he got himself a shirt of two hundred bucks then bought a cheap looking twenty bucks dress (I happened to see the receipt) for me. For the Chinese New Year, when I invited him and kids over for dinner celebration, he gave my younger daughter a one dollar red envelope, which is totally inappropriate in our culture. My mom lives with me and always cooked him nice dinners. At her 80th birthday, he just texted a happy birthday and did not make any gesture even after I told him I bought some gift for her on his behalf. It struck me more and more that he cared more about himself than me and my loved ones.

He protects himself and his children very well in this relationship and would not let down his guard. We spent nights at each other’s place but never did when our children were around for the 10 months we were together. I was open to that but of course would not initiate that if he did not, and he never did. Never had a drawer at his home but he had one at my home.

I was unhappy more times than I was happy. In mid May I took a three day break from him to think it through about our relationship and decided to give it another chance. We talked about it. My learning from this relationship is I need to be more specific about what I want. I cared a lot about his feelings and was always very gentle when communicating my unpleasant feelings. I told him during the conversation that I was unhappy about him ignoring me, that my need for his attention was not met. Also we had different understanding and expectation on how to love. I cited the culture difference to be nice about it (big mistake again) and told him in our culture we believe that to love is to give and sacrifice sometimes a loving relationship but in western culture, it is more about individual and self centered. He is smart enough to know what I was trying to convey but was more concerned about how much sacrifice he makes was enough. It of course made me upset again that he was again more about himself. After this conversation, instead of stepping up his actions, he scaled further back his effort in the relationship.

Cont.; July 28, 2015 at 6:08 PM
Anonymous said...: Our sex life was not that satisfying too. He has performance issue but has avoided addressing that even though I subtly suggested quite a few times he may need to see his doctor. He does not think he has ED but tested his testosterone level at annual check-up. It came back normal. I felt frustrated many times that the performance was not good enough. I believe this had much bigger impact to our relationship subconsciously than we realized.

July 8th, I finally broke up with him after realizing my unmet needs and disappointment at him. He was not hugely surprised but tried very hard to win me back for the next two weeks. He said that he loves me very much, he had never felt more at peace and at home when he was with me. He did not know I was this unhappy (as if I never communicated with him). He thought what we had was very rare…etc. etc. He was upset that I was not willing to put in my energy and time into the relationship but just wanted to exit. He believed those were hurdles that could be overcome but I seemed to put it all on him instead of talking it through and working it out together. He gave different excuses for his lack of following through too. Most of the post break up communications were still about how he felt and he did not offer apology until I asked him. So I became even more disappointed after those post-breakup conversations at the same time felt genuinely conflicted. I still love him and felt heart broken as well but my gut tells me I am not his priority and I am not that important to him. I never initiated any contact after the break-up, but I always responded. I continued to stand firm on my decision all the time and did not give him any false hope that we would be back together and told him that both of us need time and space to grieve and heal.

On Sunday July 19th, we met in person to talk openly. For the very first time, he admitted that he knew he blew it, that the relationship was so smooth and easy that he took me and the relationship for granted. He wanted to get back together still and mentioned that he was still considering going to Maui when I am going there early August with my kids. He sent me an email telling me he missed me crazy on Monday after the meeting. I responded in two days that space and time are healthy for us to process our raw feelings now and that I was not considering reconciliation at that point.

cont.; July 28, 2015 at 6:09 PM
Anonymous said...: Wednesday, he went to Oahu with his best friend to get away for three days. Friday, when I was cleaning our old Match emails, I was curious to click his profile. Wow, so shocked that he was active there within last 24 hours!! Meaning a couple of days after (or maybe earlier than that) he said he missed me so much, he never thought he would be this heart-broken at his age, I am the one he loves most, precious things don’t come easily and should not be given up, he regret he lost sight that even the easiest relationship needs effort……now he cannot wait to meet new people. He sounded so sincere in our meeting and in emails! I can’t help feeling fooled and tricked into believing what he said!! It hurts so much because there is such a contrast between what he said a few days earlier and what he did immediately after. His profile says he looks for someone who does not sweat small stuff but feels and experiences life at deep profound level. Obviously he thinks that the reasons I broke up with him are small stuff that I sweat over. It is probably more revealing than the others that we have different values. I think following through promises, taking ownership and self reflection are important but he does not apparently.

I am on NC now for a week and have cut off any email, phone, WeChat, text, social media and will continue to do that. In a few days my birthday is coming. Soon it will be one year after our first date. He may contact me and for sure I will let him know that I saw him on Match so soon after all of his sweet words. I cried for days after the discovery but now became more settled into letting it go. And your articles help a great deal too!

In your opinion, is this a good guy material who is just clueless and worth a second chance with some training, or his actions do not measure up to his words, it is good to just let him go even if he returns for another chance? I still love him and miss him a lot but am not willing to settle for anything less than what I expect from a loving relationship.

thanks so much!
Leo woman; July 28, 2015 at 6:10 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Pisces,
"Why would he ever come back if his last memories of me are so horrible...?"

You don't know that they're horrible. Just because you feel bad about yourself doesn't mean the entire world sees you the same :-)

If he truly cares, and you remain silent, he'll get curious and eventually touch base again. But if I were you, I would not wait around for that. I'd live my life, move on, and put him firmly in my past where he belongs. Things that are meant to be, will be. And when things don't work out, it's for a reason.

And when they don't work out twice, the reason doesn't matter. All that matters is that this was not a match, and it's time to move on and not waste anymore time on something that wasn't meant to be.

"How can he not see his wrong doing?"

He may, or he may not. But again, HE is NOT what's important here. What's important is you, and moving forward with your life, accepting that this wasn't meant to be - and moving on to find a man that wants the same things you want in life :-)

"he sees that I'm emotionally unstable and he'll never come back to me will he?"

Well, again he may or may not. Chances are though, that if you stay silent and he doesn't hear a peep from you, he'll become curious and circle around again. That could be a month from now, it could be six months from now or it could be a year from now. Either way - NEVER sit and wait around for a man. Life is too short to set it aside for someone else and sacrifice good years on nothing, ya' know?

And who knows, when/if he does circle around again. . .you may not even want him anymore by then. That happens a lot once you emotionally detach from a man and begin to see him for who he truly is once the veil of "fantasy" is lifted and the harsh reality is all that's left behind.

"He sees what bullet he's dodged and he'll never want me again. My emotionally neediness and clingy behavior has caused me the one person I've ever really loved. I hate that I am overly emotional. I hate that about myself. I don't know what to do."

Well - what you need to do is maybe forget about dating for a while altogether. . .and focus on yourself. Focus on developing coping skills for yourself that you can fall back on when suffering anxiety, so that you don't take action during those anxious times and instead, practice self-love.

Once you get the anxiety under control, the emotions soon follow. And once you get the emotions under control, the behavior follows next. And once you get the behavior under control, you become more relaxed and confident in yourself. And once you become more relaxed and confident in yourself, you begin to exhibit positive energy. And once you begin to exhibit positive energy, you become much like a magnet and you begin to draw equally positive experiences back to yourself.

BUT - this ALL starts with YOU. Change starts with you.

Because here's the thing. . .if you cannot love yourself, no one else can either.

Cont. . .; July 28, 2015 at 6:13 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: If you don't learn to love yourself, all that will happen is an exact repeat of the entire situation, only with a different man - again, and again, and again. Because when people are extremely insecure and they don't love themselves, they "project" those insecurities onto whomever they're with. And this is a recipe for disaster. Let me explain how "projection" works.

Say your man just needs some space. He's had a few rough weeks at work, things have been hectic, and he simply needs some "me time" and a bit of room to breath. It happens to us all, life gets hectic, it's no biggie.

And if that man is with a confident woman who is independent, has a life of her own, has hobbies and things she enjoys on her own as well that she can now spend some time on as a result - all will be well. A few weeks space will go by but eventually, once everyone is good and rested and has spent some quality time taking a little break and refreshing their spirit. . .but eventually they'll pick up where they left off as if nothing ever happened. And the bonus is that during that time apart, they've each been participating in healthy activities to pass the time that they've received enjoyment from and can actually share updates on with one another at their next dinner date for some good conversation and bonding.

That's how a confident woman handles herself. But what about a woman who doesn't feel worthy, doesn't love herself, and as a result figures everyone else must feel the same about her - so she begins behaving as if that's actually the case and starts projecting her insecurities onto another?

Here's what happens. She hears "need some space" and the next thing she hears is the earth crack in half. It's now doomsday. Everything is ruined, it's the end of the world. She hasn't loved herself or practiced self-love, and she basically puts everything she has into a man and expects to receive her happiness in return. She's been co-dependent on another human being to provide her happiness for her, instead of her having a full life of her own and participating in things that make her happy and feel good about herself.

So she starts to question everything - INTENSELY - her man included. He just wanted a little bit of space to do his thing and renew his spirit because he's feeling life's overwhelm, but instead of receiving that refreshment he's yearning for, he's now in a pressure cooker. And he can't even deal with himself or take care of himself as he had wished to, because now, he has to deal with someone else's emotions and low feelings of self-worth, and he has to take care of that person instead of himself. . .ALL the time.

He has to endure long talks full of emotional mood swings that tax his spirit and weigh him down. He has to play therapist to someone else, instead of taking care of himself as he'd wished. He has to answer questions, all the time, and a lot of them. And even if he answers them, the same questions will be asked again and again and again - only worded differently. Because the individual he's facing is projecting their insecurities onto him and forcing him to deal with them and even when he does, this individual will STILL not accept his reassurances. . .because the individual is not right with themselves, and doesn't love themselves, so no matter what anyone says - no matter what reassurances are given and no matter how many are given or how often they're given. . .this person hasn't worked on their own issues, so they're not going away. Nothing is ever fixed because the individual is not doing anything to work on their own issues or doing anything to make themselves happy and is instead, expecting some other human being to come along and provide their happiness for them.

Cont. . .; July 28, 2015 at 6:14 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: The individual is dependent on other human beings for their happiness. And because of this, it becomes very difficult for other individuals to spend time with them because their needs are hefty, they're constant, and in the end spending time with them feels more like work than fun and romance. People enjoy being around others that make them feel good and that they can have fun with. When the good feelings and fun suddenly turn into work and exhaustion. . .well, most people eventually distance themselves from that because it's an emotionally taxing experience on them that drains them of their own energy.

That's what happens when a person doesn't love themselves or work on their own feelings of self-worth and instead, depends on others to provide that for them. The other person is eventually drained emotionally and to protect themselves from any more of this, they distance themselves from the other individual.

And that is why it's SO VERY IMPORTANT to be right with yourself, to be whole, to have your own life, to have your own interests, to be able to spend time alone with yourself enjoyably, to have hobbies, to have friends and your own social circle, to love yourself, and to know your worth. . .before becoming romantically involved with others.

Because again - if you don't love yourself, it becomes virtually impossible for others to love you.

Let all of this sink in, give it some thought, and then become excited and inspired by it. Let it catapult you into a new day, a new way of thinking, a new way of doing, and a new way of being.

Your life can change and you can find happiness, with or without a man believe it or not - if YOU work to make a change ;-); July 28, 2015 at 6:14 PM
Anonymous said...: You really "laid into me"... (smile)... but it needed to be done.Everything that you suggested, is exactly how I am. I am annoying and exhausting. I really appreciate everything that you stated.. I will take your advice and really, really try to work very, very hard on loving myself and working on myself.

You know, for 10 years I've dreamed about this man and now I've lost him. I can't believe it's over..

Thank you, again, for everything

Pisces; July 28, 2015 at 8:02 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Pisces,
I didn't mean to "lay into you" - my apologies for offending. I just vibe off straight talk and quite honestly, I've been where you're at, which is why I'm able to speak on the topic the way I have. And truth be told, the hundreds, if not thousands, of women who have commented here. . .have all experienced what you're experiencing in one way or another too. So you're not alone. You're not the only woman out there who struggles with issues of low self-esteem. It's part of the human experience. Every single one of us have insecurities. The only difference comes down to those who take action on them, and those who do not and instead manage them. But any way you slice it - we ALL have them.

I hope you understand that I said what I said to help you, not to hurt you.

Because insecurities CAN be overcome. It doesn't happen overnight, it's a journey, and it takes a lot of hard work. But it can be done.

And don't write this man off entirely just yet. He may or may not return. But the important thing is that when or if he does - you want to be good with yourself when that happens so that this entire experience doesn't repeat itself. Which is why I advocate focusing on "self" during the down time. Because that's where it all begins for each and every one of us.

"Your beliefs become your thoughts, your thoughts become your words, your words become your actions, your actions become your habits, your habits become your values, your values become your destiny."

For each and every one of us, it all starts with our beliefs (about ourselves). If you believe that you're worthless and damaged, then that belief becomes your thoughts, your words, your actions, your habits and so on. On the flip side, if your belief (about yourself) is that you're a real catch and you're worthy of love, then that belief becomes your thoughts, your words, your actions, etc.

Again - it all starts with you, and your beliefs about yourself. Because those beliefs about yourself are what will be thrust out into the universe for others to see. So you have to get right with yourself, you have to learn to love yourself, and be kind to yourself. . .if you want to receive love and kindness back from others.

There are many women here that have been, and currently are, in your shoes. And if you spend some time reading through the comments on various articles on this site. . .you won't feel alone. This site functions much like a support group. I don't permit bashing to take place here and as a result, many women visit regularly and come her for support regularly as they travel their own personal journey to wellness and happiness.

Ten years ago, my life was much like a Jerry Springer episode LOL. That's what I like to tell people. But it got to the point where I said "enough is enough" and I became a "seeker" of inner peace. I am not the same person today that I was ten years ago. And if that can happen for me, it can happen for you as well sister ;-); July 29, 2015 at 9:43 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Sara,
"Should I contact him soon?"

I would not. Because the only way a woman can know if a man is genuinely interested in her, is to see if HE pursues HER. Consider this piece, written by a man:

http://www.therulesrevisited.com/2011/09/dont-initiate-contact.html

"maybe he decided he doesn't like me because of the star sign conversation?"

Well, if a man is that quick to judge you, based on one silly conversation, then he's not a man you want to spend any significant amount of time with anyway.

"I worry that he might think I don't like him enough"

I don't see how that could be. He texts, you respond. He asks for a date, you join him. He hugs you, you hug him back. He kisses you, you kiss him back.

What, in all of that, signals that you don't like him?

If you didn't like him, you'd ignore his texts, you would refuse date invites, and you would not let him hug or kiss you. Don't let your anxieties get the best of you. Don't let your "worries" affect your behavior, and don't take action on them. Be confident, stand strong. If this man isn't a match, it's best to find this out now, rather than later, after you've invested months or a year of your life trying to make it work, only to have it not work in the end.

If he doesn't hear from you, he'll get curious and he'll touch base. And if he doesn't, and that doesn't happen, then he's not the RIGHT man for you anyway, and it's a blessing that that was discovered very early on, rather than much later down the line.; July 29, 2015 at 9:56 AM
Anonymous said...: @ MOA,

Not at all (smile) You were not offensive in the slightest! Everything you pointed out was very true and I have already started the internal process, by first, accepting that there is a deeper issue that needs to be resolved. You're helping me and you certainly didn't have to do so. So I thank you, sincerely and I respect your no b.s. approach. You are sincere and very tactful. I am happy to finally have a home of support. Because let's face it... when you're dealing with matters of the heart, without the right support, you will potentially go insane! Lol I will continue to further familiarize myself with your site, other articles and comments!

As for my cancer guy, I can only hope that the universe would be so kind and send him back to me. Until then, I will employ the 30 day no contact rule and start the reconstructive process of my inner self.

Please wish me luck... I am soooo going to need it..

Thanks again, MOA... You are, undeniably, heaven sent :)

Pisces; July 29, 2015 at 3:47 PM
Anonymous said...: This is July 27 1:43 , to the poster who asked me about reversing it- I meant a man is supposed to take care of you, not you take care of a man. When you take care of a man, reassuring him because he seems to need attention or whatever he's doing by acting out, you will get more bad behavior. Don't reward bad behavior. And let a man take care of you, sure, here and there we take care of them when they have shown they are good men, NOT when they are being jerks or they will just be jerks more. Hope that clarifies.; July 30, 2015 at 12:58 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Leo Woman,
"In your opinion, is this a good guy material who is just clueless and worth a second chance with some training, or his actions do not measure up to his words, it is good to just let him go even if he returns for another chance?"

Well, you can't train men. They're people, not dogs obviously. They are who they are. And you either have to accept them for who they are, or decide that they're not a match for you.

And while you have feelings for this man, after reading your comment, I honestly feel that deep down inside you know, and may have always known after a few months, that this man was not the right man for you. He was incapable of fulfilling your emotional needs, he was selfish, he took you for granted, and he was not appreciative. . .nor did he really care or try very hard to be any of those things.

You stated:

"Those words stuck in my mind that his needs came first even when he did something wrong"
"I became unhappy that he did not show he cared about how I felt."
"I felt totally unsupported and started to think he is selfish."
"It struck me more and more that he cared more about himself than me and my loved ones."
"I was unhappy more times than I was happy."
"Our sex life was not that satisfying too."

You may not realize this - but all along, it looks to me like probably since the 2nd month, you were not happy and this man was not fulfilling your needs. I think you realized that, but you stayed and continued to try by "do, do, doing" for him. And the harder you tried and the more you did for him, the more he began to take you for granted. He, himself, even admitted that "he admitted that he knew he blew it, that the relationship was so smooth and easy that he took me and the relationship for granted."

And what that tells me is that should you give this man another chance, most likely for the first month - maybe two - he may change a bit. But he is who he is and it wouldn't be long before all of this would most likely repeat itself. Once he'd become comfortable in the relationship again, chances are he'd slip back into his old ways and be unable to sustain the changes necessary.

And let's say he actually DID make some changes AND sustain them. The sex would still be disappointing. He'd most likely still place himself first. And he'd most likely still maintain a bit of selfishness. So in the end, what's left to really go back for more of, ya' know? This guy is already facing his THIRD chance here. Around the 2 month mark, when I believe you really noticed this wasn't a match, you took a break from him and the relationship - and then took him back. That WAS his second chance. . .and NOTHING changed.

Sometimes we love people and care about them deeply and still realize it's not a match. And while no one can predict the future, there's a very high likelihood here based on past patterns that if he were to be given a 3rd chance. . .you'd still be unhappy more often than not. And the fact that he's jumped into the dating world immediately without taking the time to heal from a relationship breakup that he claims he's suffering terribly from. . .tells me that nothing's changed and that this man is still all about him and his own needs.

When a man's words and actions do not align, it's always a big red flag that something's not right :-(

Cont. . .; July 30, 2015 at 7:56 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: If I were you, I would not even think about issuing any third chances to this man unless I saw HUGE changes in him first. And by that I mean repeated and consistent acts of selflessness, compassion, and behavior that aligns with his words.

And even then, you really need to consider whether this man is even capable of fulfilling your needs and maintaining values that align with yours. Because even if he makes some changes, but still maintains his old values, chances are it still would not be a match ya' know?; July 30, 2015 at 7:56 AM
Anonymous said...: Dear Ms. Mirror,

Leo Woman here. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom. I am getting better every day since NC 10 days ago. NC does work. It is not about him, it is about me. You are right. I knew in my gut all along this man may not fulfill my needs. Just because he was always nice, sweet and gentle and we have deep connection, I ignored again and again to trust my instinct feeling and continued to give and give out of my love for him. All his behavior after our break-up further confirms what I told him - I still love him but I don't think we are for each other.

I have to admit my ego was bruised by his going back to Match so soon, but I gained more clarity from his action as well. Both my best friend and my therapist suggested that if he initiates next contact, I ask him how I should interpret the inconsistency between his words and his action to go back on Match so soon. It is a hard reality to accept so now I feel curious and want to hear from him directly. But honestly I don't think I will care to know anymore by the time he may come back. No matter what reason he chose to be back so soon, either he is afraid of facing his deep pains as he claimed he suffered from, or he truly cannot wait to meet new people, it does not matter anymore. What do you think?

Another question if you don't mind sharing your opinion.......If he comes back and asks for a friendship after our raw feelings are gone, would you think it is a good idea to accept friendship? You've heard so many women's stories here. We both share a lot of common views of life and have deep connection with each other that both of us never experienced with any other people. So our relationship was also our friendship. That's why I feel so sad too that I not only lost a relationship but also a best friend. It's not that I want to go back to have a romantic relationship with him again - as you said I don't believe he is going to change who he is. I usually take time to make a major decision and don't easily change my mind unless there are strong reasons to convince me otherwise. I just feel the kind of deep connection we have is rare in life (he claimed the same too). Both of us are calm and mature people and I believe we are able to handle it. There are hurt feelings involved in the break-up but it was amiable and friendly. In your opinion, is it possible to have a mature and calm friendship after we both recover from the break-up in future even if we don't have a romantic relationship? I've maintained platonic friendship with some ex's.

Ms. Mirror, you are helping so many people on this board. I get so much strength here from the stories people shared and the insights you shed. I sincerely thank you for all your time and effort. May all the positive energy go to you and people here.

Leo Woman; July 30, 2015 at 4:03 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Leo Woman,
"If he comes back and asks for a friendship after our raw feelings are gone, would you think it is a good idea to accept friendship?"

Generally speaking, I don't think this is something that's good for people because you truly do have to have two very emotionally mature people to accomplish this successfully. It's not that it can't be done. It's just that for most, it's very difficult because one person always wants more. But if the two are each able to successfully manage their emotions while maintaining the friendship then it can be done.

"No matter what reason he chose to be back so soon, either he is afraid of facing his deep pains as he claimed he suffered from, or he truly cannot wait to meet new people, it does not matter anymore. What do you think?"

No one really knows for sure what's motivating his behavior right now - besides him. But regardless of what's motivating him, what's really important here is that he's showing you a lot right now in doing so. So pay attention to what that's telling you.

Because even if he's doing this because he's hurt - it tells you that he's not very emotionally mature. Instead of taking the time to deal with his emotions and process them in a healthy manner, he's practicing "escapism" and he's running from them, and at other people, instead. . .which isn't a very healthy practice because you can only run so far. Eventually, your emotions catch up to you and you have to deal with them.; July 30, 2015 at 4:59 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear MOA,

This is Sara here, thank you for your reply and advice - I followed it. I didn't get in touch and so he got in touch the next day asking me how I am etc. He also asked me again to check that he WILL get to see me when I get back and I said 'yes sure you will'.

All was good until I made a mistake. Two days after his initiation I messaged him to basically say 'hey there, how are you, remember that movie I recommended well here's the link to it'. However, his responses were with a 3 hour delay each time and spanned out till nightime when he never replied to the last message with the link to the movie. The message had been delivered but not read and on facebook I could see him being tagged in pics going out so he could have easily just read the message and said thanks. I am making a fuss about this because, MOA, I have had a series of guys who couldn't give a s*** about being nice to me and romancing me and charming me to keep me and instead ignored messages by replying the following day or didn't bother to initiate conversation with me. I am really frustrated because THIS guy seemed into me and ignoring my text when you're out having fun and not actually busy with work pretty much sucks. I don't know what to do now.

I am looking to date a guy that is consistently attentive and allows us to get to know each other with the view of leading to a relationship. I have no patience left to mirror casual guys. I thought this one wasn't casual and now I'm wondering whether I should just not reply when he eventually gets back to me today and kind of disappear on his ass. I really can't deal with difficult situations right now, I have a million different things on my mind and I need a guy who will lift me up and make me enjoy myself not be an extra pain. I have also been hurt too many times and I can't afford another player who will go laughing all the way home after he has made me look like a fool multiple times. I am 27 and I realise that I am very unlucky in love and might actually end up alone....I'm considered a good catch I know that but every time a guy is infatuated by me and seems excited like this guy....at some point they lose interest.

I knew it was a mistake to send him a message yesterday.....I listened to my mother truth be told who really liked the sound of him and insisted I say hello to him to mirror the regular contact he'd created. Now I feel like I've lost my position of 'mystery' and 'attractiveness' that I sensed he felt towards me and I'm the girl he can ignore and reply to the following day........I feel like disappearing completely.

Many thanks,

Sara; August 1, 2015 at 3:38 AM
loretta said...: @Mirror and @Leo Woman: I rarely disagree with MoA; in fact, I think she is MONEY, HONEY! But, after having two narcissistic husbands and several emotionally unavailable "boyfriends," I realized that they don't always have their emotions catch up with them. Sometimes they simply don't have the same kinds of emotions that normal people have. They have run from them or buried them or drowned them in alcohol or other compensatory situations for so long, they lost touch with them completely.

The satisfaction of knowing that they will one day have this awakening, like a big brick falling on their heads is probably a fantasy. IF they ever get a clue, you may never know. So, don't count on that wonderful shadenfraude some day. Just knowing you have your act together, that you can love without expectation and enjoy the loving for its own sake is enough. Don't hope for them to call you some day with remorse. Don't expect amends. Don't expect them to be miserable. They are already miserable in a lot of ways.

I try to fill my world with people who enjoy me, who appreciate what I do, and I avoid people who make me unhappy or feel insecure. I try to do what I love and avoid what I don't like. If the men in my past (and future) are broken, I can't fix them.; August 1, 2015 at 9:05 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Sara,
"Two days after his initiation I messaged him to basically say 'hey there, how are you, remember that movie I recommended well here's the link to it'. . .but every time a guy is infatuated by me and seems excited like this guy....at some point they lose interest."

Well, I know you're looking at this as if their behavior changes after the initial infatuation period. BUT - could it be that it's YOUR behavior that actually changes once a man is interested in you? I see that a lot, so let me explain the concept.

Men like a challenge and they like competing to win (hence their love of sports). The chase is actually FUN for them. But what can sometimes happen is once the man gives chase, and the woman realizes it and sense the man is "into her," she'll turn the tables without realizing it and she'll start pursuing him, removing the fun of the chase from the equation for him. And yes, men consider a woman contacting them "pursuit."

So you might want to think about it - when you sense a man is into you and he begins pursuing you - do you turn the tables without realizing it and begin pursuing HIM instead? Do you start contacting him and attempting to garner attention from him? Do you start saying hello in the morning and goodnight in the evening? Do you begin to take the masculine role (leader, initiator), forcing him into the feminine role (submissive)?

Notice this part "I didn't get in touch and so he got in touch the next day asking me how I am." You did not pursue and as a result, he had the opportunity and space to do so - and he did.

But then "Two days after his initiation I messaged him. . .he never replied to the last message."

Notice what's happened there? When you DIDN'T pursue. . .HE did. But when YOU pursued, he did NOT respond. When YOU stepped into the masculine role (leader, initiator), he did not respond. When you stayed in your feminine role (submissive), he DID respond.

So could it be that it's your behavior that changes as the situation progresses (you move from "submissive" to "initiator"), and not the man's? And could it be that because the man notices this, he distances himself as a result?

Just something to think about, because I see this a lot :-)

"I have had a series of guys who couldn't give a s*** about being nice to me and romancing me and charming me to keep me and instead ignored messages by replying the following day or didn't bother to initiate conversation with me."

YOU shouldn't be messaging THEM.

In the early days of dating, the only thing a woman needs to do to signal her interest in him is submit to the man's lead if she chooses to. She should not be taking the lead from him.

In order for him to pursue her, he needs the time and space able to do that. If the woman starts contacting him and taking that opportunity away from him, she's basically stealing all the fun of the chase from him, by chasing him instead of letting him have fun chasing her.

Cont. . .; August 2, 2015 at 8:01 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: "I have no patience left to mirror casual guys"

But you're going to HAVE to have patience. Nothing hits the ground running and if it does, that's always a big red flag (that it will burn out just as equally fast as it began). If you think the man is only into casual dating and he'll never move it to the next level, then don't respond to him so that the situation doesn't get strung along. But if you sense that the man could move it to the next level, you have to exhibit patience and not attempt to take the lead to move things along at the pace you'd like it to go. Because if you take the lead from him and you start to attempt to control the pace, the man will sense this and he may distance himself from it because it begins to feel like he's being pressured and he feels obligated and he's no longer having fun, it feels more like work now, and he's no longer able to chase. . .because he's being chased instead, so he runs away. Does that make sense?

Again, men love sports. They love competing to win. They cherish things that they worked hard to earn. The consider dating a sport, and the "thrill" comes from the chase for them. That's what they find fun, exciting and exhilarating. So early on, you have to have patience and let them partake in that. All you have to do to signal your interest is respond to their lead. And then later on once the relationship progresses and the man asks for a commitment, THEN you can begin to initiate a bit once you've agreed to be a couple.

But during the very early phases. . .let the man chase ;-); August 2, 2015 at 8:01 AM
Anonymous said...: Thanks so much MOA :-)

It does make sense. I don't know how much I will stick around for this guy as I already feel that it may be end of story with him. I've been talking with my brother and his friends and they think if he did actually like me enough he would be texting every day and so I think that chances are I'll be wasting my time once again.

Obviously I came across as needy or masculine now and I don't know if this is reversible? I'm looking at the guys I know and they're texting away all day with their crushes and new dates...

I'm not quite sure how to move from here with this one. I could mirror him... But when I get back from my trip with trip (feeling the cold from him) sure enough he'll ask me out (unless he's already gone for good) and sure enough he'll try and sleep with me and that's when I will be thinking: Should I be avoiding and play games like mirroring and come up with a lie to not sleep with him or just straight out tell him his lukewarm behavior doesn't seem promising and I'm not looking for sb lukewarn who will sleep with me and then sure enough become cold and disappear.

I can mirror and play cool etc but at the end of the day doesn't all this just show he's not that into me and a roll in the hay is just about all he's interested in?

All the best

Sara; August 2, 2015 at 10:46 AM
Fire&Water said...: @ MOA, I think what Sara did is the kind of thing I would do. You have a conversation with somebody about something: a movie, a piece of music, etc that they're unfamiliar with...and you want them to see it/ hear so you can talk about it later have a conversation about it. In my head, that's how you start to get to know each other. Are guys really that absurd that if we so much as say "here, here's this thing I like that you might be interested in too. Take a look at it so we can discuss what you think about it", they decide we're trying to abduct them down the aisle and run? How do you get to know somebody if they run when you so much as try to create a basis for conversation? I know I'm not good at dating. And I've been studying here like crazy, trying to figure out where I can improve. But this seems so illogical to me. Where's the line between engaging someone and a guy thinking you are chasing? That doesn't sound like being hard to get. That sounds like being a statue. Have I misunderstood your point?
I probably do change my behavior once a guy seems interested - I start to treat them like someone I can discuss things with (not how bad my day was, but topics: sports, literature, politics (maybe, lol). Should I be keeping everything very superficial and conversing with them as if they were random strangers until they ask for a commitment? And in that case, what are they committing to? If they won't engage me about things I like, they can't possibly know me. And also, how does that let me get to know them? I've had it happen a number of times that a guy tells me he likes/has an interest in something, only to discover that when I try to talk to him about that topic, he has nothing to say or can't do what he says. Example: SO many guys "like" horses. Until you get them next to one. Then I get the "that's a reeeaaaallly big animal"...as they're hovering in the barn door, looking like they're about to pee themselves. Yeah, horses are big. And I get on them, gallop them, jump them, get bucked off them, get reared with and still get back on. Can ya handle that, pal? My best friend is married to a great guy who watches her with this huge look of pride on his face and tells everyone "That's my wife!". I don't seem to meet that kind of guy.
Sorry for the dissertation. I'm just confused...and confusion doesn't work well for me :D; August 2, 2015 at 11:51 AM
loretta said...: Good news on the dating front - hope I don't jinx it. I had a really nice first date (second time we actually met) with a Capricorn man who seems to really have his act together. Compared to flighty Sagittarius Casual Guy (who drives me nuts), this guy seems solid. He also seemed to like me. There was definitely chemistry for the first time since the one DM who disappeared and reappeared and I cut that off. I didn't think of comparing this new guy to Casual Guy until I got home. I realized that I have been really blocking myself from moving on, and now I feel ready. Even if things don't happen for this new guy, I do feel the shift. It's like being able to taste food again after months of no taste buds.

Meanwhile, Casual Guy is so afraid I'm going to get mad at him again, he's making a big effort to schedule writing meetings and not cancel them at the last minute, which he has been doing all summer. When he canceled last week, I was nonchalant about it. I think that makes him even more nervous. LOL...like I don't give a crap anymore. He needs me to give a crap.

I suspect (and predict) that my energy will have changed and Casual Guy will notice that I'm not so into him anymore, that I don't make him the center of my universe anymore and he won't like it at all. Let him realize what an idiot he is. Unless he gets sloppy when he drinks, I won't know what he's feeling, but I'll watch for signs of him trying to get my attention again once I start fading away. And if not, no big deal, I am onward and upward. I can't believe how long I stayed stuck on that treadmill, unable to move on from him. He was so wrong for me (wrong for anyone, really). Now I can be friends with him without all that weirdness and emotional frustration. I've been putting on an Oscar-worthy performance of detaching from him. Now I can do it for real.; August 2, 2015 at 11:12 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror,
first of all, thank you for all your excellent articles, we all need to read this from time to time to get stronger!

I have a different situation, there is this cute guy that happens to attend the same university as mine, except that I am pursuing a masters degree while he's a PhD student. I met him at the library, we were a bunch of friends studying and then he offered to help us with something we were stuck in.

I found he was handsome but wasn't really attracted to him, until he came to talk to me, it was about the subject we were studying but when we first talked, it seemed like something was going on, the conversation was so easy and funny, without us putting any effort into it. I have to admit they are few guys with whom I get this feeling. we had some really funny little moments, but then, he's just gone, without him asking my name/contact..nothing!
Few days later, it seemed like we meet by coincidence wherever we go, it was weird and kinda funny for both of us, he had this little cute and embarassed smile, I'm very natural and not intimidating but still, he just says Hi and continues walking. I do the same despite my desire to get to know him.
As the days go by, he were more open and his smile was much more warmer but still, just saying hi and asking me how am I doing. I told a friend of mine about this and one day she told me that she noticed him looking at me a lot, until I look at him and he's acting like he just saw me LOL! and then waits until I smile at him to talk to me, the same few friendly words and then he's gone. Every single day! then I began to notice his glances too...but that's all. Now the weird part is that he's doing nothing to approach me, not even in a friendly way! I know he's not seeing anyone , b/c we've been stalking him a bit LOL, he's not gay, and doesn't seem to be that desperately lacking of courage! so before reading this, it looks like I made lots of mistakes, friending him on fb, wishing him a happy birthday on fb, then after 1 month or so I asked for his help on the same subject he helped me on before. I even wished him a happy chritsmas! he's responding very well, but that's it, just responding, and not trying to know me in anyway, not initiating any sort of contact! Just responding to exactly what I initiate, in a gentleman style, with a very respectful way,nothing more! Now if he's not interested why is he acting very weird around me, the way he looks at me, the way he smiles at me is so different from his usual behavior. He mimics me when I do something with my hands. I tested it in our daily hello thing LOL ! I feel this b/c it's been months now. Still no contact initiating!

I do not want a relationship right away, I just want him to do something to get closer to me as friends and see where it goes.But looks like he's kind of avoiding it.
Is it just me overanalyzing?
Anna.; August 3, 2015 at 6:36 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Sara,
"I can mirror and play cool etc but at the end of the day doesn't all this just show he's not that into me and a roll in the hay is just about all he's interested in?"

That's what you'll have to invest some time into to find out. You'll need to observe his behavior for a while, see if his words and actions align, and then make an informed decision for yourself :-); August 3, 2015 at 8:11 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Fire and Water,
"Are guys really that absurd that if we so much as say "here, here's this thing I like that you might be interested in too. Take a look at it so we can discuss what you think about it", they decide we're trying to abduct them down the aisle and run?"

In the very early days of dating, if you being doing this regularly, yea, you do run the risk of them distancing themselves if it no longer feels like fun to them and starts to feel more like an obligation and work.

"How do you get to know somebody if they run when you so much as try to create a basis for conversation?"

You let the man pursue you, and then you respond to his pursuit. You let him contact you, and then you participate in the conversation he's started if you choose to. You take the feminine submissive role and you let him be the masculine aggressor in the situation. Because the only way a woman can know if a man is genuinely interested (versus simply seeking sex), is to see if HE pursues HER. Consider this piece written by a man:

http://www.therulesrevisited.com/2011/09/dont-initiate-contact.html

"Where's the line between engaging someone and a guy thinking you are chasing?"

In the very early stages, the man should be engaging the woman and initiating things with her. He should take the lead masculine role, while the woman resides in the feminine submissive role. Because whoever "starts" something is the aggressor. And the definition of "aggressor" is someone who starts something FIRST. So whoever takes action first IS the aggressor - they're the one pursuing.

"That doesn't sound like being hard to get. That sounds like being a statue."

A statue IS hard to get. . .you'd have to do something pretty darn impressive to make it move ;-)

The point here is that dating and mating is a dance of sorts, where the man leads and the woman submits. He contacts, you respond. He calls, you answer. He texts, you answer. He asks for a date, you join him.

He starts something first - and you respond. It's a dance where the man leads, and the woman submits.

"Should I be keeping everything very superficial and conversing with them as if they were random strangers until they ask for a commitment?"

You should converse with them on any topic that THEY start a conversation on, preferably setting the "heavy" topics aside, and keeping it very light, carefree and fun.

"And in that case, what are they committing to?"

They are committing to you - and agreeing not to date other people. They are committing to only exclusively being with you, committing more time to you, committing their heart to you, and committing their focus to you.

"If they won't engage me about things I like, they can't possibly know me. And also, how does that let me get to know them?"

If you've dated them for a while and they're not engaging you about things you like. . .then it's safe to say it's probably not a match and that person isn't the right person for you, as it'd be clear by that point that there was nothing in common.

This "observation" period let's you get to know them and realize that - there's nothing in common :-); August 3, 2015 at 8:32 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA, me again (3 month guy/ phone broke/ hardly any contact from him). An update for you! So, I may have been a little impulsive/impatient- I'm an Aries!! and ended up messaging the guy myself last week..I know, I know, I should have left it up to him but it was sending me crazy! Anyway, I live with 3 guys and they said just message him, seeing how he is and ask him if fancied going out for drinks sometime, just the two of us (to avoid a group date situation). So I heard back from the guy 2 hours later, saying he was camping for the next few days and then his brothers are down for the week but after that he'd be keen. Then asked how I was etc. I replied saying let me know when you're free and we'll sort something out. Answered his questions but didn't ask him any. A few messages continued between us over the next few days but nothing else now. I know he said he was keen but kinda feel he may think he has to agree to drinks out of obligation? I really don't want to force anything or come across as clingy/needy. Finding it so hard to understand what this guy is thinking! Last message was sent by me on Friday, and I have left the ball in his court now to message me when he is free for a date. However, I feel like I'm being walked over by waiting for him to message me? Despite this message, the guy does think I'm pretty chilled as that is the vibe I've been giving off to him (these thoughts are all internal at the moment!); August 3, 2015 at 8:40 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Aug 3, 8:40 AM,
"ended up messaging the guy myself last week. . .ask him if fancied going out for drinks sometime. . .A few messages continued between us over the next few days but nothing else now. . .I know he said he was keen but kinda feel he may think he has to agree to drinks out of obligation?"

That's why it doesn't pay to pursue men. You end up giving your power away to them, and it only causes even more confusion for the woman, placing her in the "lesser" position and signaling to him that you'll possibly be waiting around for him :-(

"Finding it so hard to understand what this guy is thinking!"

Well it's really not that difficult. A man's actions, or lack thereof, always tell you all you need to know. If he's pursuing you, then chances are there's a genuine interest. If he's not pursuing and taking no action, chances are he's not genuinely interested :-( Either way, there's no need to attempt to figure that out because the actions, or lack thereof, make it pretty clear.

"I feel like I'm being walked over by waiting for him to message me?"

Well again, this is why it doesn't pay to pursue men. When a woman does that, she gives her power away to him and places herself into the "lesser" position, signaling to the man that she's waiting to hear from him, and sitting around waiting on him to take action. You never want to give a man the impression that you're willing to do that, because if you do, they'll treat you like that from that day forward. And unfortunately, he now knows you're waiting on him, he knows he's "got you" right where he wants you, and he knows he can take his jolly good old time getting back to you, or not getting back to you, if he so chooses, because he's been given the power to do so :-(; August 3, 2015 at 11:03 AM
Fire&Water said...: @MOA,
I'm sorry - this is still not making sense. I love SO much of what you say, but I'm just stuck on this.

"In the very early stages, the man should be engaging the woman and initiating things with her. He should take the lead masculine role, while the woman resides in the feminine submissive role. Because whoever "starts" something is the aggressor. And the definition of "aggressor" is someone who starts something FIRST. So whoever takes action first IS the aggressor - they're the one pursuing."

So, bringing up a topic, or handing a guy a cd (yes, I'm still on CD's) to listen to is pursuing? Like, if we talk about Celtic music and I give a guy a CD and say "here, listen to track 4. I think that piece is amazing and you might like it too"...that's pursuing, and too much pressure?
To me it seems like if he's not even willing to expend that effort then I shouldn't even bother with him.

"A statue IS hard to get. . .you'd have to do something pretty darn impressive to make it move ;-)"

Actually, I think a crane and some attachment hardware would probably suffice :). That being said, very few statues have long term romantic relationships either ;)

"You should converse with them on any topic that THEY start a conversation on, preferably setting the "heavy" topics aside, and keeping it very light, carefree and fun."

This sounds like 'speak when I'm spoken to'...about what I'm spoken to about. I'm not sure I'm explaining this well, but I feel like by doing what you're saying that I wouldn't be being "real"; I'd just be this funny, fun echo of the guy.

"If you've dated them for a while and they're not engaging you about things you like. . ."

So, is it just that if the things they talk about and choose to do don't interest me, then I know it's not a match?

I.e. it doesn't really matter if they know me? They just have to think I'm pretty and fun so they stick around long enough for me to observe them. And then I choose whether or not who they are is right for me?; August 3, 2015 at 4:13 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Fire and Water,
"So, bringing up a topic, or handing a guy a cd (yes, I'm still on CD's) to listen to is pursuing?"

If this is a guy you've dated or are dating and it's the very early casual stages - yes - a man will consider that pursuit. . .if you're the one who initiated contact to do this and there's an existing romantic interest.

"Like, if we talk about Celtic music and I give a guy a CD and say "here, listen to track 4. I think that piece is amazing and you might like it too"...that's pursuing, and too much pressure?"

If you hand over the CD during the conversation, no it's not pursuing. But if you have an existing romantic situation with the man, and you contact him at a later date out of the blue and ask to meet him somewhere to give him a CD - then yea, a man will consider that pursuit.

"To me it seems like if he's not even willing to expend that effort then I shouldn't even bother with him."

I agree, if you have to pursue a man to get a slice of his attention, and he's not expending any effort on you - then chances are he's not worth you time.

"This sounds like 'speak when I'm spoken to'...about what I'm spoken to about."

All I really meant by that was set the heavy stuff aside for later, and focus on fun, carefree issues in the early stages, because you'll be able to observe who HE truly is. . .and you may discover he's a man that's not even worth having the heavy conversations with.

In otherwords, don't invest too heavily into something that isn't worth investing in - until you know it's worth it. And until then, keep it light because people are attracted to light, fun, carefree energy.

"So, is it just that if the things they talk about and choose to do don't interest me, then I know it's not a match?"

When I have nothing in common with someone, I don't consider it a match. Because if someone doesn't like to do what you like to do and doesn't have any common interests - chances are it's not a match. Because those types of small issues have a way of becoming huge fractures in a relationship later on down the line.

"i.e. it doesn't really matter if they know me?"

I don't understand how them knowing more about you would somehow magically create common interests where there are none.

"They just have to. . .stick around long enough for me to observe them. And then I choose whether or not who they are is right for me? "

That's how to be in control of your dating life - yes. YOU making decisions about THEM, instead of sitting around trying to impress a man and then waiting on HIM to make a decision about YOU - this places YOU into the power position:

http://www.aphroditeastrology.com/2014/02/dating-feeling-helpless-what-to-do.html; August 3, 2015 at 8:03 PM
Fire&Water said...: @MOA, re: Aug 3 @8:03 ..Wow. Ok. That's pretty different from what I've been doing/thinking. I will brush up on my best Judy Holliday impersonation :) and give that a try on the next frog. Thanks for being patient with me! :); August 4, 2015 at 8:57 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror, this is WONDERING again. One more question, please. As I continue to stay silent and not contact the man who asked for space, if/when he does call me, should I let it go to voicemail and wait for him to call again? If he texts, do I continue to ignore it until he wants to talk vs have a casual conversation? I really need some guidance here so I'll be prepared when the time comes. (My situation is a little different regarding my medical trauma incident, but he did ask for space. He's never been mean in any way towards me.) I think I can handle it from that point...don't be too interested, play hard to get, make plans 3 days in advance, don't answer every call, take an hour or so to return texts, don't initiate anything, etc. Having implemented the NC for almost 40 days now, it's surprising just how strong this can make a woman! And it definitely clears your head! I'm so glad I was silent and didn't contact him and I have my dignity and self-esteem in tact. I've always known my value as a woman, but during a heartbreak, the NC reminds me in a powerful way. Your blog has helped me a lot with staying strong with NC, I've read the Rules from years ago, Why Men Love Bitches, Why Men Marry Bitches, and Ignore the Guy Get the Guy (GREAT content but really needs editing). I've re-read these books everyday for over a month now and visit your site each day. You all have made me so strong and confident. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH!! WONDERING; August 4, 2015 at 10:57 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anna,
". . .looks like he's kind of avoiding it. Is it just me over analyzing?"

Well, I believe it's gotta' be clear to him that there's an interest on your part, because you've already taken several actions and opened the door, so-to-speak, to let him into your life:

"friending him on fb, wishing him a happy birthday on fb, then after 1 month or so I asked for his help on the same subject he helped me on before. I even wished him a happy chritsmas!"

Unfortunately, he's not responding with a romantic interest at this time. And there's really nothing you can do about that. For whatever reason, he's not taking any steps towards moving this along any further. He may not be interested in anything romantic with anyone as he may be focused on his studies. He may be talking to someone already, but just hasn't moved it to any official "relationship" status. He may have a girlfriend at home, or someone he's interested in at home. There are a multitude of reasons that could be listed. But the bottom line is he's not making any moves, and there's really nothing you can do or say to force him to.

Besides, let's say you made a bold move and invited him on a date. He could take you up on that offer. He could even sleep with you. But afterwards, he could disappear and move on because he wasn't all that interested in anything with anyone to begin with - and all he had done was take you up on your offer, ya' know? And in the end, you'd end up having walked right into a situation where you permitted yourself to be used, in the hopes that it would lead to more, only to have that backfire and cause pain and emotional damage. It's not worth it, which is why I'm not an advocate of women pursuing men. If a man is genuinely interested, and he knows where to find you. . .HE will seek YOU out ;-); August 4, 2015 at 11:23 AM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror,
Thank you for you honest words. I totally agree with you on the masculine role of pursuing, and I don't like to do this as a woman. It's not fun, and not changing anything to the best, because it's not a woman thing.
As you said :
" I believe it's gotta' be clear to him that there's an interest on your part, because you've already taken several actions and opened the door, so-to-speak, to let him into your life " Unless he's stupid LOL!

After a lot of thinking, I must admit that I have to gather my courage to let him go and move on. I've said it so many times before, but deep inside, a part of me was actually waiting for him to do something. I don't want to wait anymore, it's been months and I'm not really the patient type of woman when there is nothing encouraging me to keep waiting, and by nothing, I mean actions...Maybe it will be a bit awkward at first because I may bump into him very often.

"... If a man is genuinely interested, and he knows where to find you. . .HE will seek YOU out ;-)" Looks like I will have to note this on my walls LOL!

Anna.; August 6, 2015 at 8:08 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anna,
"... If a man is genuinely interested, and he knows where to find you. . .HE will seek YOU out ;-)"

I know a lot of women probably read that and think - well maybe he doesn't know. Maybe he needs a bonk on the head LOL. Maybe if I just hit him with it and asked him out myself, he'd go.

And he probably WOULD.

But here's the thing - when a woman does that, when she takes matters into her own hands and takes the lead like that. . .she places herself at GREAT RISK of being used.

And why is that?

Because the man may not be genuinely interested (in a relationship with the woman), but he'll still go along with her offer anyway (to see if he can receive sex). And when that's the case, when you've drawn a man towards you that isn't entirely interested but is going along for the ride anyway, if you sleep with them (thinking a relationship will come of it), nine times out of ten, after one or two encounters. . .the man up and disappears.

Why?

Because he never wanted a relationship with the woman in the first place - but he was up for some "fun" so he went along with it for a while. But he pulled a disappearing act before the woman develops any real emotions that may cause her to begin pressuring him for a relationship (generally speaking, most men expect that to happen after sex, so if they don't want that, they bolt).

So when women question why you really shouldn't pursue a man because they see no harm in it - there actually IS harm in it.

You can pursue a man and even "land him." But none of that guarantees a relationship. Most times, it only guarantees that you'll get laid -- and nothing else.; August 6, 2015 at 11:46 AM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror,

To be honest, sometimes men do not know if we are interested. But this is definitely not a reason why we should pursue them. I do believe in subtle feminine hints, just enough to show a spark of interest, nothing more! and just enough to create some mistery, about what kind of interest it is, which is why the hints should not be sexual, as I read in many articles on the internet! I'm totally like whaaat this is so cheap comming from a lady..even gentlemen don't do sexual hints to show interest, this is for cheap players, or beginners. I believe the hints should say I like to have you in my life, but should not say in what kind of way we would like to know them. It's like telling someone that we like them as a person. because when a woman acts like this, whether the man is interested or not, she wouldn't lose her time, energy, nor her dignity, plus, she wouldn't be really attached when time comes to gather some willingness and courage to move on and admit that it was not meant to be.

This is what I have learnt from all this story, I'm glad I didn't go any further towards the guy I like. Otherwise I would have regretted it.

Anna.; August 6, 2015 at 1:56 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi..I wanted to start by saying I wrote on here two years ago and stopped talking to a guy and he resurfaced a few months ago..but i guess i was apathetic and uninterested and so we never tested again. I say that to say that it seems as tho they always resurface. However, Im writing today about a new person...yes, Im still going thru this lol unfortunately but im learning slowly i think. I just started dating again and I met a guy who seemed really great...he was all over me from the beginning texting and calling and asking to hang out..met him on okcupid...this was short lived and only two weeks...good morning texts every day ..textin all day long...first date he asks me to be his girlfriend which i thought was odd..i didnt say anything cuz i thought he was joking especially for the guy...so the second time we hung out he asked again and i said yes altho i guess i felt reluctant inside it did feel rushed...he always texted he missed me etc. well i guess i liked the attention after not dating and having that for so long... i will admit that....anyway..we were intimate but saw each other several times after that...prob had sex too soon (again i felt a little pressured but i gave in anyway and i take full responsibility for that and my role in that)....First day we were out he was upfront and honest that he was going thru financial difficulties and bankruptcy etc...I met alot of his friends...we all got along...im sure the financial stuff is true. Fast foreward two weeks....outta nowhere on a Tuesday my good morn text is gone....we texted here and there and he inconsistent...he finally says hes having major personal problems mostly financial and needs time to figure things out. I said ok and good luck. He writes back "i still want to talk to you, i just need time to figure things out ya know?"... "dont give up on him yet blah blah" anyway, I see him one more time for a party that he had already invited me to...the day after that party we spoke and he made some mention that if we ever stopped dating he still wants to be friends and me in his life..im a great person, yadda yadda..he trusts me. He said he shut someone out before when he was having problems and they coulda been friends and he didnt want to do that with me. Following week he sends a few texts my way...hey whats up ...how are you doing today kind of thing...one said he missed me....etc...i spoke to him the end of that week because his texts confused me...and he said he just wants to be friends, he has too much going on in his life to give attention to anything. but he just needs friends right now and he still wants to "chill" with me lol...meanwhile as i supsected hes still on okcupid saying he wants a relationship. so im prob gonna answer my own question here and say that hes keeping me open as an option or friends with benefits. I am not interested in being an option or just friends or friends with benefits cuz now i dont trust him...so i had no words to say and did not reply to his last text saying he just wanted to be friends. that was 3 days ago...I deleted his number and have no intention to ever contact him again. Im not interested in just being friends. So why am i writing this if I dont care? i guess part of me wishes that he would attempt to reach me and contact me again...idk lol Do you think he will? Do you think he sincerely wants to really be JUST friends? thats what im wondering I guess... where that is all nice and everything...I dont think I could do that anyway..or was he just trying to let me down easy but then continued to text afterwards..anyway...he told me he just wanted to be friends and i had no clue what to say to him...I had no words and so i didnt reply and I reply to EVERYONE. So its been 3 days and i havent texted and neither has he....thoughts?; August 10, 2015 at 2:31 PM
loretta said...: Hey Anon at 2:31 PM above - I have adopted a philosophical position on these types of experiences. I consider it a sign from the universe that this is not The One. That guy is a loser. You are so much better off without him. I've had 3 new Disappearing Men and while I can't figure out what I did to scare them off, I consider it a sign that the right guy is in my future. Fine.

Don't beat yourself up about the sex. Big deal. You'll get over that. But I would wait....wait...wait...before I ever did that again. I'd rather be in a sexual desert than setting myself up for pain. I'm sure MoA has great advice. Onward. Next!; August 10, 2015 at 9:08 PM
Anonymous said...: My boyfriend broke up with my 3 weeks ago after I brought up some issues. He had some pictures of women on his computer. He sent me their pics supposedly as a joke. After he noticed I wasn't laughing, he told me they were his cousins.
I recognized one of them. I told him that I don't believe him. He went into how they were from his mothers side, he said I knew about them, and he also said "well, I don't know how to make you believe me." I told him that I recognized one of them (she is his friend and he only met her less than a year ago). Finally he admitted that they were indeed just friends. He said that he told me they were his cousins because he was embarrassed.
I told him that it wasn't so much that he had their pictures, but it was that he lied to me. The fact that he kept elaborating on the lie bothered me more than the initial lie. I explained that I felt I couldn't trust him and that I need some time to think.
We were supposed to talk later the next day. But he said I was making a big deal out of a silly picture and he broke up with me. He also deleted me from his social networks.
It has been three weeks without any contact. I took a couple of weeks to let my emotions cool down, then I became active on an online dating site (no dates yet, just being virtually active for the time being). Now, after three weeks of no contact whatsoever, he has sent me a friend request on facebook.
Maybe I am being selfish, but I feel I deserve more than a friends request. I am trying to not let my emotions take charge, therefor I haven't accepted the request. Does this mean he wants to initiate contact? Should I ignore it until he contacts me with a explanation of what his intentions are?; August 11, 2015 at 10:47 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi Loretta...ha ha the funny thing is as I predicted...this guy texts me today...Hi how are you today? I havent responded as of yet....I will be happy to hear what Mirror says...I think Im done with the situation tho..hes more confused than me. (I think) lol; August 11, 2015 at 3:36 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Augusr 10, 2:31 PM,
"So why am i writing this if I dont care? i guess part of me wishes that he would attempt to reach me and contact me again...idk lol. Do you think he will?"

Yep - I do. . .but it won't be for the reason you may be wishing it to be for. This guy's going to circle around for sex again :-(

"Do you think he sincerely wants to really be JUST friends?"

Yea - friends "with benefits" unfortunately. I don't think he's seeking friendship in general, I think he's seeking to remain friendly with you, so that he can reap some benefits from that from time to time.

"he told me he just wanted to be friends and i had no clue what to say to him...I had no words and so i didn't reply"

I wouldn't reply either - unless you truly do want to remain friends (and not just "friendly). Otherwise, if that's of no interest to you, and you suspect he's seeking to string you along as an option for sexual benefits, then I'd let this go, I wouldn't respond, and I place him firmly in my past.

If you feel otherwise and you want to stick it out, he has said he just wants to be friends. Okay fine - then that's EXACTLY what he gets - JUST FRIENDS. And that means no sex, no fooling around, no sexting - NOTHING that true friends don't do. He can choose friendship if he likes, but there are consequences to a decision such as that. . .and he'll have to stick with them if that's his choice:

http://www.aphroditeastrology.com/2012/11/how-to-say-no-dating-life-consequence.html

But if it were me - I'd write this guy off and move along. It's not working because it's not meant to be, as Loretta stated. And when things aren't meant to be, that means that what IS meant to be. . .is still waiting for you ;-); August 11, 2015 at 4:42 PM
Gem50 said...: @ Anonymous 8/10 2:31,
I read your post this morning and thought, "She should be proud of herself!"

You are learning dear. That's what it's all about. It took a bit, but you've figured this guy out and you are taking care of yourself first. Good for you.

As you practice, you will get better at recognizing things quicker and make decisions for yourself based on what's best for YOU.

Funny story for all: Scorpio is still popping into my life every once in awhile. It's all a game for him, and I've told him that I know it. Like Loretta, though, with her writer friend, I care for him. He's actually been a hard - yet valuable - lesson that I've learned in life, but wouldn't have -- if not for him.

So, I've been basically paying him very little attention. I've responded to his 2-3x/week texts very vaguely and keeping them short. Saturday night he was texting like crazy and I ignored them all. Monday night he text and I just said "going to bed, good night." So today he texts in the afternoon, which he never does. I wait until I'm out of work to respond, then wait through drive home before I respond to numerous texts again. We chat, and just when I wonder to myself, "I wonder how he is going to get out of this when the gf comes home," he says, "I just remembered I have to drop the car I worked on today off at 6:30."

My response?

"Ok, bye."

He freaks, he has 45 minutes to go until 6:30 and not ready to end our conversation.

I ignore him, then finally respond with, "Haha funny."

He keeps texting, I say, "Stop. Go deliver car."

He responds again about what he's got to do, and I don't respond. And I won't for awhile. I don't have to say a thing. Just as Ms. Mirror has explained, live our lives for what WE want, let these guys figure this crap out for themselves.

He knows. I know he knows. I've told him plenty of times what I want for my life without placing responsibility or blame on to him. It's quite a powerful feeling, actually.

So, anonymous, you stick with it. You'll get this -- and a whole lot sooner than when I did in life!

Cheers!; August 11, 2015 at 7:09 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Aug 11,10:47 AM,
"he said I was making a big deal out of a silly picture and he broke up with me."

It is a big deal and he KNOWS this, which is why he's overreacting about it (he broke up with me. . .deleted me from his social networks) and attempting to manipulate the blame onto you.

"after three weeks of no contact whatsoever, he has sent me a friend request on facebook"

HA! I would NOT accept that request. If you do, it'll basically signal to him that it's okay to treat you this way because you'll easily let him back into your life regardless.

"Does this mean he wants to initiate contact?"

No - nothing on social media means anything. Social media is not to be taken seriously, it's for "entertainment" purposes only. If he truly wanted to initiate some REAL contact, he'd pick up the phone and call you.

"Should I ignore it until he contacts me with a explanation of what his intentions are?"

You should ignore it, HIM, and ALL his actions. . .until he APOLOGIZES to you. He's a grown man, his own behavior brought on this entire situation, and as an adult he knows what the right thing to do is. If he isn't man enough to take responsibility for his own actions by apologizing, then he's not a guy you want to date or spend a lifetime with anyway because every time there'd be a problem, he'd act childish, blame it on you, and then do nothing to make it right - which is a nightmare of a relationship to be in. So if he cannot apologize, it signals he's not mature enough to do what it takes to maintain a committed relationship anyway.; August 12, 2015 at 9:54 AM
loretta said...: It's great to be back in the driver's seat,, eh, Gem50? I left a comment about being "FRIENDS" with a guy on the Dating a DM thread (Had Your Fill?)

Rock on, girls!; August 12, 2015 at 9:55 AM
loretta said...: Mirror has yet more evidence that a disappearing man will reappear. So, awhile back I had a few dates with a guy who disappeared on me three times. I was going out on other dates with other guys, but I did notice he would disappear for days or weeks, then reappear with an email or a phone call. Finally, he sent me a chain email and I told him it was idiotic. He took it personally, and wrote back that I just used that as an excuse to cut him loose. I responded that he wasn't showing me any real interest, so what's the problem? We went back and forth a little, but it ended there.

A week or so ago, he sent me a joke political email. I didn't respond. Yesterday, he sent me another one. I responded with "Why are you still sending me emails? Do you want to see me?"

He responded today writing that he thought he was too conservative for me, but "you never know." Then he listed a bunch of things he did this summer, travel, festivals, ballgames, etc. and how great his summer was. Asked me what I did all summer.

I responded, "I wrote a movie."

LOL; August 12, 2015 at 9:00 PM
Anonymous said...: This is Anonymous Aug 11,10:47 AM. I really appreciate your response and advice! I never did acknowledge his friend request on facebook, and he ended up deleting the request. I found his behavior toward the end shocking compared to his previous behavior, it made me wonder how many other lies I had been told. I have heard that you learn more about a relationship after a breakup than you do before. It can be hard to not look at things emotionally, but being logical really pays off. I am really glad I found your article, thanks so much for your help!; August 12, 2015 at 10:22 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Loretta,
"He responded today writing that he thought he was too conservative for me, but "you never know."

So. . .inclusion in chain emails is somehow supposed to signal to you that he's possibly interested LOL?? Wouldn't it be easier to just oh. . .I dunno. . .ask you out!

But I think I know what that was about. You're supposed to act desperate, and cling onto any little bit of communication he creates, and then respond back to him with an overwhelming need to see him, begging and pleading for another ounce of his time:

"Hey that chain email was great, I've been dying to hear from you again, and I was so over-the-moon when I received that email that I couldn't stop thinking about you since! Won't you please, please, please come see me? I'll cook you dinner, I'll perform tricks like a circus monkey to entertain you, I'll rearrange my entire schedule and uproot my entire life. . .if I can just have one more hour with you - PLEASE!"

LOL ;-)

Grown men. Grown men tip-toeing around like little boys hoping all the little girls on the schoolyard playground will chase them around. . .so they can be mean and swat them away to feel better about themselves.

Too conservative?? Try - to lame.

When you feign disinterest, guess what guys? Intelligent women actually come to believe you're uninterested in them. Go figure, whodda' thunk it, huh? LOL ;-)

And I love this part "he sent me a chain email and I told him it was idiotic. He took it personally, and wrote back that I just used that as an excuse to cut him loose."

Excuse to "cut him loose." Umm. . .how can you cut someone loose that's not attached to you in the first place? How can you cut someone loose that isn't even dating you and only emails or phones you from time to time? How is that a "connection" that needs to be "cut loose" at all?

It's all rather entertaining actually LOL.; August 13, 2015 at 10:18 AM
Anonymous said...: Hello Mirror,

Would love to hear your thoughts please. Sorry this might be long.. So I was dating a man from Sept last year, not exclusive. Its long distance. He always answered texts, phoned, etc but did cancel dates a few dates out stating he had to deal with his 16 year old son (who lives with him) and couldn't get away or work etc. He would arrange other times. I did lean back wasn't too interested in him and so would delete texts and emails etc and think meh...cant be bothered he seems too wrapped up in his life and not ready to date. Anyways he would always pop up with a text or a phonecall and it would never go longer than 3 or days before he would. I ended up meeting him in April, he seemed to suddenly really want to spend time with me, came to see me three times paid for everything, said hed been really hurt in relationships (I noticed he said the odd mean thing about his exs's - red flag) and he didn't know if he wanted a relationship. I said well that's cool but im not into casual dating, this has been going on for 6 months its not progressing so im moving non. He said no wait let me just get some help, I really like you and he did start showing up a lot as I said above. He always seemed to be busy though and I thought this guy is a commitment phobe ( I told him that) and or emotionally unavailable and doesn't want me but doesn't want me to go either. He agreed! He said relationships scared him because he had been infactuated with a woman who cheated on him and he had really affected him.

So I did notice when I wouldn't respond go quiet he would lean forward, anyways one time he was coming to see me in June, again he cancelled last minute and said he would come the following week (which he did). By then I was tired of the whole deal, thinking I deserve so much more your obviously fucked up on some level that's beyond me. He got very upset sent me an email and came the next week. I had ended it 4 times with him in 9 months just because he was doing the hot cold thing. Im also new to dating and at 48 was naïve and hadn't seen this kind of behaviour before.

Anyways he comes to where I live we get a hotel and we talk, alot, he says he really really likes me and 'that's the problem' he cant stay away. I said is there other women...he said absolutely No, none, but I have commitment issues and I want to keep seeing you but I don't know if I can give you what you want. He never wanted to have intercourse. We had done other things and I made him wait till the 8th date to start getting into it. He said we would have intercourse on the 20th date as it protected both of us. I thought this was weird but I was naïve and he seemed like a gentleman on all other levels.

Anyways he leaves to go home and goes quiet. I get an email 3 days later to say hed talked with a best friend and he knew he had to start making better decisions so he didn't hurt people and himself. I called him two days later, he sounded flat, terrible, and said he had become quite low. .

Didn't hear anything from him for a week, so I called him he sounded shocked to hear from me. I said I have I been dumped lol. he ummed and arred and said Idk I guess, I just need space right now. I was angry because he had messed me around for a long time ( I now know I let him!!! after reading your site) and told him why the hell would he come to see me and get a hotel if he wasn't interested. Id given him an out several times... We didn't have sex and he wasn't even into me helping him get off he was just focused on me and pleasing me. He was quiet and said he didn't know that it was too complicated and confusing for him and that even hearing my voice was confusing for him. Im immediately thinking shit hes been playing me theres other woman......this is where it gets good...; August 15, 2015 at 12:53 AM
Anonymous said...: I made a phone call to a woman he had spoken to me about. Yup I got her number. He told me she wouldn't leave him alone after one date. Turns out they had been having a texting relationship the whole time I had known him and in that time, 5 dates but only kissed a couple of times. She said he didn't seem that into me but kept on texting me and when I said im done he would say 'wait let me get help'....omg! She told me to ring his ex wife as the x wife had talked with her. Well I did....turns out he cheated on his x wife with her best friend she was pregnant with their 3rd son. He gave her herpes and crabs also. The x wife told me hes empty inside and has been chasing woman for years but has had long term relationships ( 4 each around 4 years) since there divorce. She said she thought he could be bisexual but hadn't acted out on it and when they were married he could go months without wanting intercourse from her. She thought maybe he had used escorts but wasn't sure. They remain friends but she feels sorry for him. He is very good to her and all his other exs (who yes still are his fb friends) . Ive realised this is a very insecure man who uses women to fill himself up.

I called him livid and told him what I now knew and that he had been stringing me along, and telling me lies, and despite my pulling back, no leaning forward and ending it he continued to pull me in....I shouted at him. He then said "michelle im in a fucking hole, my life is a mess im so sorry words are not enough, you don't deserve my shit. ive been doing this for 30 to 40 years because I feel empty inside and like shit. he said I want to speak with you about what ive done when I know you will trust me an I can trust myself...I said I know theres other women and you even texted you ex gf last week to have a cuppa with you. he said I know I know let me get help. I need to get through my counselling which im getting. I told him I didn't believe his bullshit as hes been telling his exs for years hed get help and he was only sorry he got caught by me and now was trying to protect his ass from any other damage I might do.

We hung up and he sent me an email saying he would talk to me when he knew he was able to have an honest conversation with me and he didn't know when that would be. (that was three weeks ago on the 26th July) He also said I know you don't believe me but the universe knows im committed to getting help.

cont..; August 15, 2015 at 12:55 AM
Anonymous said...: Whats so funny about all of this is while I dated him he kinda let me know he felt sad and concerned about some stuff from his childhood, etc but I did not know he was a player. His x wife said yes hes a player. So im sitting here angry now thinking, do I wait for him to come to me with his honest responses to my questions or do I go no contact till he contacts me and then do the no response.

Im obviously not interested in pursuing anything with him but he manipulated me to the tenth degree, he really did.. i don't do one night stand and i leaned back observed him and made him wait to get intimate with me..i really did. I have two adult children and ive never had poor boundaries. So id like a face to face apology and for him to explain why he thinks its ok to screw woman like me over when theres women who shag straight away and escorts etc.. Love to hear your thoughts. He holds a high powered position and has since taken down his fb page, and his instagram page. I asked he remove himself from Skype, which we used alot. I couldn't do it due to Skype changing the format. He didn't so my son had to uninstall Skype and reinstall it so I could block him.. I feel sorry for the guy...but at the same time he needs a big lesson. He told me my phonecalls had caused other phonecalls to be made and now he was in a bad way and that everyone had given it to him. So I wonder is the 'i want to have an honest conversation another manipulation to buy time while he hopes this blows over and he can protect the ot her women he has going on or hes finally going wtf have I done..im 55 and cant keep doing this. Thank you.! this man is kind but obviously very wounded and has become good at telling lies but at the same time its almost like he hates himself for doing it hence no intercourse and how depressed he is now. Btw his x wife said my phone call had absolutely floored him and as a result she told him how much damage hes done over the years. Good I say!!; August 15, 2015 at 12:57 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Aug 15, 12:53 AM,
"So im sitting here angry now thinking, do I wait for him to come to me with his honest responses to my questions or do I go no contact till he contacts me and then do the no response."

If it were me, I'd write this man off once and for all and never look back. You're NEVER going to get honest responses, he barely even knows the truth himself, and there's no reason to continue this situation at all unless you want more of it. Because someone who's been exhibiting these patterns of behavior for 40 years is not going to change. And I hate to say this, but I don't even think therapy is going to help him accomplish that because therapy only works if you apply the techniques and practices provided into your lifestyle to CHANGE your behavior.

And based on what you're saying here, his behavior remains the same. And this has been confirmed by his ex wife and also another woman. So it's clear that he is NOT committed to therapy as he claims. If he was, he would not be exhibiting the same behaviors.

"id like a face to face apology and for him to explain why he thinks its ok to screw woman like me over when theres women who shag straight away and escorts"

I can understand your want of that, but honestly, you're never going to get that - or I should say, you're never going to get an apology that you KNOW is sincere. There will ALWAYS be questions, no matter what he says or how he says it. So in the end, this apology really isn't going to be as helpful to you as you think, because you're never going to know if he really means what he says.

"I feel sorry for the guy"

I can also understand this but truth be told, he probably doesn't deserve your sympathy. And I say that because he is 100% fully aware of his own issues, yet he does nothing to help himself work through them. He's not changing his behavior, he's not making different decisions, and going to therapy and not applying one thing you've learned there to your life is useless.

So knowing all of that, you need to understand that he is making these choices for himself. Meaning, he knows all of this - yet still CHOOSES to live his life this way. And when it's a personal choice like that, no sympathy is needed. He's a grown man and he needs to be accountable and responsible for his own actions. He's making his own choices, and he's choosing to proceed through life in exactly the same manner that's damaged his relationships all along.

So why feel sorry for him? It's his choice and he's willingly making it. He doesn't deserve the benefit of doubt here and there are consequences we all have to suffer for choices we make:

"He told me my phone calls had caused other phone calls to be made and now he was in a bad way and that everyone had given it to him."

Oh well. Shit happens ya' know? Particularly when you CHOOSE to live your life this way. It all catches up to you eventually and when it does, and these are choices that you have willingly made. . .stop seeking sympathy for others and playing on their emotions for the consequences you have to suffer as a result of your own actions and instead - man up, take the hits because you deserve the and, take accountability for your own actions.

Cont. . .; August 15, 2015 at 11:18 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: This guys ENTIRE GAME relies on manipulating and playing on the emotions of women. He uses the "poor me, woe is me" game. "I can't help it, I had a bad childhood. I know what I'm like, and I'm trying to change, but I haven't gotten there yet."

You know what? We've ALL had bad experiences in childhood. Some worse than others. But guess what? We don't ALL feel entitled to hurt others and do damage just because we've been through some shit.

Don't buy what this guy is selling - it's a rouse. A game. And it's how he's been able to do what he's been doing for the last 40 years.

"So I wonder is the 'I want to have an honest conversation" another manipulation to buy time while he hopes this blows over and he can protect the other women he has going on"

Yep. That's exactly what it is. And you've received validation of this from his ex wife and another woman. Like I said above, that IS his game - "woe is me." He's a player, and he's doing what players do. . .toying and playing with the emotions of others to enable them to continue doing what it is that they do.

"at the same time its almost like he hates himself for doing it, hence no intercourse"

Maybe so. But my gut is telling me there's a LOT more to that no intercourse story. My gut is telling me that he has performance issues and that the no intercourse thing is more about protecting HIMSELF versus the women he's with.

"his x wife said my phone call had absolutely floored him and as a result she told him how much damage hes done over the years."

The only thing he's floored about - is being caught and cornered and being forced to face the music with many. That may sound mean, but I'm not buying the "poor me" bit he's selling. Players are self-absorbed. They don't care about others, they care about themselves. His angle is always going to be about protecting HIMSELF.

And here's a prime example of that:

"He said relationships scared him because he had been infatuated with a woman who cheated on him and he had really affected him." I call bullshit. Relationships don't scare him because he was cheated on. Relationships don't scare him at all. He DOESN'T WANT A RELATIONSHIP, commitment is not something he seeks. But instead of being honest about that, the player resorts to his "game" - woe is me, poor me." And this "woe is me" angle about supposedly being cheated on and it destroying him is what helps PROTECT HIM - from commitment.

Whether he admits it or not, getting over on others and being able to successfully manipulate their emotions brings him joy on some level. My guess is that it makes him feel in control and powerful. He's a very insecure man, so power and control make him feel manly. He's not finding that in sex, because my guess is that his performance suffers, so he has discovered that being in control and exerting power over others provides the same "high" and satisfaction to him that's similar to a sexual encounter. And yep, I do believe he uses escorts because with them, if his performance fails he loses nothing. But if he has sex with the woman who are actually providing him with what he needs (ego boost, power and control), he FEELS HE'LL LOSE THEM (because of his performance) - which is why he doesn't risk it.

Cont. . .; August 15, 2015 at 11:19 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: I talk a lot here about the need to avoid dating extremely insecure individuals. Because you can't save them from themselves and in the end, they do an incredible amount of damage to those around them that care for them. And I've also stated many times that nine times out of ten, insecure men CHEAT. It's inevitable. They need a HUGE amount of female attention to propel them through life so whether they set out to cheat or not, the end result is that needing so much attention, more than one woman can provide, means that they need several women in their life at all times, which ultimately leads to cheating.

I wrote about it here, and I think you may be able to relate to much of this:

http://www.aphroditeastrology.com/2015/02/insecure-men-dating.html

RUN - don't walk - away from this man. And don't ever look back or he's going to keep you stuck in this loop of madness, yanking your emotional chains, for as long as you'll let him.; August 15, 2015 at 11:19 AM
Anonymous said...: HI Mirror,
You are amazing....thank you for your response Aug 15 11.19am. Wow..Im in no contact I really am. I do wonder if players like this still circle back or because I made so many phone calls and outed him that he would think holy f**k what have I done? Id love to hear your thoughts on that. Are they that cocky that they will still circle back and try to manipulate? I mean some guys MUST come to a point where they think dammit im 55 this isn't working or me. and YES I think looking back he had performance issues. I noticed he would go flaccid then erect then flaccid..up down,.. Guys that use escorts or watch porn and then try to seduce a 'normal' girl can have anxiety issues right? or they cant stay erect because they're not with a hooker with a hot body ....?? Would love your thoughts about players and performance issues, it must happen a lot, surely.
GOD when you said that re performance my gut screamed YES....hes really messed up on so many levels. He had had a vasectomy and told me that he couldn't have a good orgasm due to having a V it had ruined it for him, 15 years ago. I googled that and couldn't find any info on it. Seems he cant have a good Orgasm if his head is filled with shit because he knows hes a douche or an excuse of a man and its really messing with. He told me he was a mess...he did sound distressed. I agree with you his chances of seeking help or at least applying at virtually nil but I do believe he feels like shit when hes alone and with himself. He KNOWS hes messed up and screwing everyone including himself....he just cant stop. Too much pain to stop too hard to look and face himself so he chooses to keep running and hurting others. Sucks..Dammit..ive learnt so much from this experience. Thank you..im still processing it all, feel like ive been sucked in deceived, and used like a whore. It feels horrible to think a man I thought liked me used my body purely to get off on. Yuk im so repulsed and feel like I could shower endlessly. How the hell this happened to me someone who waited for sex, is a mother of adult children who is careful is beyond me. Tears...I feel so ANGRY like I want to set up a web page and OUT all the players in the world!; August 15, 2015 at 6:30 PM
loretta said...: @ Anonymous w/ the Head Case experience - welcome to the unfortunate but very useful experience with a malignant narcissist! You only have to have one of these to learn the ropes. 15 years ago I was married to a guy exactly like that. The marriage lasted less than 3 years, since I was old enough by then to have a very low tolerance for his B.S. There is a pattern among MNs that repeats similarly with every one of them, almost as if they have a Handbook!

The one deviation from their usual modus operandi was that you didn't have a whirlwind romance with him. I suspect that was because of the distance. Had he lived closer, he would have swept you off your feet, before showing you his true colors. Believe me, you got off lightly and thank your lucky stars!

Typical Malignant N's go through a very specific pattern:

1. They come on really strong at the beginning. Especially if you act disinterested. They pile on the compliments, adapt to your music, religion, tastes, and learn your buttons, almost as if they are chameleons. They are excellent at mirroring you.
2. They give you a sad, sad sob story about their romantic history, painting it as if they were unfortunate victims, designed to make you resent their exes, and for sure never contact them! Their worst fear is for you to compare notes with their exes (which Anonymous did above). What a nightmare. HAHAHA
3. When you start challenging them, they threaten to leave you, or possibly admit to something minor, to get you to forgive them. Meanwhile, you never know the worst things they are doing.
4. They always seek new sources of attention/admiration. They always have one foot out the door.
5. They will mooch off you or take advantage of your generosity in every way possible.
6. If you reject them before they can replace you, they will stalk, harass, beg, borrow and steal to get your attention again. If you give in, they will treat you even worse.
7. Where they once admired you and put you on a pedestal, they will just as quickly trash you, demoralize you and invalidate you when you are no longer useful to them.
8. They have big problems with intimacy, especially in the bedroom. They prefer cyber sex, sex with strangers they never have to see again, but with significant others? Impotent.
9. They lack any sense of remorse. What they feel when they are "sorry" is regret that they got caught. Period.

Anyway, I wrote an entire book about these guys. RUN RUN RUN!; August 16, 2015 at 2:59 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Sat, Aug 15, 6:30 PM,
"I do wonder if players like this still circle back or because I made so many phone calls and outed him that he would think holy f**k what have I done?"

Chances are he will circle back, but then again, that's not something you can really predict with accuracy because each individual is different and it depends on the level of interest they had to begin with.

"Are they that cocky that they will still circle back and try to manipulate?"

Yep, many - if not most - are. Manipulation is the name of their game, it's how they get through life, and it's how they feed their ego and tend to their "issues." Much like vampires, they suck the life's blood out of those they are victimizing in order to sustain themselves, and many times, they have a rotation of women who provide them with this. Generally speaking, they have invested a good deal of time into manipulating the women and the situation to their advantage, so when that crumbles, many times they will make and attempt or two to salvage that.

But when I say salvage - I'm referring to salvaging the situation for THEMSELVES, and NOT the other involved. They want things to be the way they used to be, where they got their way. They don't come back because they've had a huge change of heart (although they WILL attempt to have you believe that is exactly what has happened).

"I mean some guys MUST come to a point where they think dammit im 55 this isn't working or me"

Sure, many do and I've seen this first hand myself - open regret. But the problem is that they only THINK it. . .and then do very little if anything ABOUT it at all and continue through lift with the status quo.

"Would love your thoughts about players and performance issues, it must happen a lot, surely."

Many times, it stems from insecurity. And insecurity is what causes many of their other behaviors as well. It's a known fact that bravado and being "macho" in a sense is a rouse to cover up deep insecurity. Overcompensating is always a sure sign that something is amiss.

So when you have a man that talks a good talk, but then cannot walk the walk - somethings up. He may be able to fool others at a glance into thinking he's confident, successful, professional, sought after, etc. but once you cut through the words and seek solid evidence of that - you generally find very little to none at all.

I believe that insecurity is what causes the bravado, and the bravado is overcompensation used to distract others from their insecurities, and there's a lot of big talk, but very little big action. . .and it all leads back to insecurity.

Many players have performance issues because they're insecure. And rather than stop and work on themselves to learn how to properly manage their insecurities, they instead take to using others to feed their egos and boost their confidence - cutting down on the feeling of being insecure temporarily for them. Instead of peering inward, they begin to use outwardly. Instead of dealing with the real issues, they use others to cover them up.

"How the hell this happened to me someone who waited for sex, is a mother of adult children who is careful is beyond me."

Don't beat yourself up for that - it happens even to the best of us. And you know why? Because we're all only human, and therefore, flawed. If we were perfect, we'd be Gods. But we're not, we're only human and these things are part of the human experience - no one is free of them.

Read through the comments on this site in many of the articles and you will see that you're not alone. Many others have gone through similar experiences. We all want love. We all want to give love. And sometimes when we want that really bad, as women we can tend to dismiss things or give the benefit of doubt when we shouldn't.

Cont. . .; August 17, 2015 at 10:37 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: I can tell you from personal experience that during the darkest period of my life - I met one of the worst men I've ever known. It was ironic because I wanted love and I wanted to give love so bad. . .and instead I ended up having one of the worst experiences I've ever had as a result. Looking back on it all, I believe this happened because I wanted this so bad, the idea of love and being loved, that it made me overlook things I shouldn't have overlooked. And it made me give the benefit of doubt when I shouldn't have. And overlooking things and giving the benefit of doubt meant that I ended up with a bad dude - a REAL bad dude. And a regretful experience.

Had I not wanted love so bad, I would've taken action instead of overlooking. I would've held him responsible for his own actions instead of granting the benefit of doubt. In the end, it became clear to me that the entire experience was a result of my hefty NEED (for love). Had the need not been so big, that relationship would've never gone as far as it did, and I wouldn't have been as hurt as I was.

But I don't blame myself entirely for that experience. Sure, I was partly to blame - but so was he. He actions weren't justified simply because I was needy at the time. And in the end I came to realize that out of all the relationships I've ever had. . .that one was probably the one I learned the most about MYSELF from.

In the end, it turned out he was actually a GREAT TEACHER to me.

Try to look at this recent experience of yours the same - and take something positive from it rather than beat yourself up over it :-); August 17, 2015 at 10:37 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi MoA!

This is Sara from 3 weeks ago...

I'm back in town and we went out again with this guy. I got back last week and we went out yesterday evening because he had a tight deadline to meet at work on Friday.

Anyway, he had asked me out for Saturday but he asked on the same day so I said I already have plans and he suggested Sunday.

On Sunday as we were texting to discuss where to go etc he tried to make it a movie at his place date. I said thats not what I had in mind and he took it back and said it was just an idea and we can do whatever I want. So we went out on a proper date (its the third date now) and everything was really nice. A few times in the conversation when we were discussing our personalities he referred to me as if I have a vested interest in his personality in a girlfriend kind of way. Also a couple of times when he was discussing things to do in the winter he said we should do them together.

In any case, at some point I asked him if he goes out at all during the week and he said he's too busy. That seemed a bit strange to me as he had said that after the deadline he would be more relaxed. At the end of the date when he dropped me off at the station, there was no date set for the next time and he asked me to text him when I get home. I did that and we were texting a bit then.

Now, I'm wondering how to act. He's been doing all the initiating so far. At some point he said maybe next weekend I can invite him to have a barbecue at my new place since it has a garden (as I'm moving into a new house today). What do I do now MoA? If I don't hear anything over the next few days do I initiate contact to show interest? Do I invite him over to my new place for the barbecue? Or do I let him continue to do the work? Also am I moving too fast in expecting that now we should have very regular contact?

Sara; August 24, 2015 at 8:02 AM
Anonymous said...: Hello mirror!

This is the first time I've had a guy reappear YEARS later! I know it's not a special case, but it's a little different because I've always treated this guy as a really great friend.

We met on Okcupid over 10 years ago when I felt that connections were more genuine. Never flirted. Just open communication about our lives and getting to know each other. (He's on the East Coast and I'm on the West Coast.)

He resurfaced yesterday -- saying it occurred to him that we haven't been in touch and would like to open up communication if I was up for it.

Then updated me about his job situation...he left his job last year, and was now looking for a new one.

My first thought wasn't "omg! I miss him, I should email him back right now" (the old me).

I thought "That's not an apology. Plus, why would he email me NOW? Is he looking for emotional support? Then when he gets a new job, he may possibly disappear for a few more years LOL?"

I've re-read your No Contact article, and the standard action for dating situations is 30 days.... do you think that applies in this case? Or would responding in a week still have the same effect?

He was a very important part of my life -- especially when I was going through a break up with my ex. I miss the guy, but I'm still ticked off by his disappearance (it must have been at least 3 years).

- Vivian; August 24, 2015 at 2:12 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Vivian,
If he disappeared without warning years ago, and that hurt you - I wouldn't be so quick to respond because chances are, responding period will only lead to another disappearance. He's thousands of miles away, he's already got a tainted track record, and realistically not much can come of this because of the distance - so why place yourself into a situation where you potentially become emotionally invested again, only to suffer the same exact scenario years later?

Just doesn't seem worth the risk I'm afraid, because on top of that, the man isn't even anywhere in close proximity to develop anything more than "virtual" with anyway. At best this will be a text buddy and nothing more most likely, and that could distract you from what might appear right in front of you someday :-(; August 26, 2015 at 5:10 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi MoA,

This is Sara again. Quick question about how to deal with texting. I'm texting with this guy the last few days and its texts with about 2 hour intervals. He has initiated every time as I have followed the advice you give here. Thing is that a couple of times he has got back to me the next day if the conversation went on till late at night because I'm guessing he fell asleep. Is that okay or do you think he is signalling no commitment?

Today is a bit worse though - he texted me at around 8pm to ask me if I have plans for the weekend and I responded an hour later and still he hasn't even read my response and its now 12am. Do I take this into consideration or not? Thing is if we do go out this weekend (which I expect) then probably things will move on with him... But I worry as always whether I am missing any bad signs, whether the texting is good enough and whether I am being too flexible again. I also worry about keeping the interest going. I mean okay I delay in responding but now its just become a foreseeable pattern with no uncertainty. If he gets back to me tomorrow morning with no explanation as to his disappearance from today when do I respond? Do I show him a reaction by responding a whole day later? Do I continue with the hourly delay? Do I make a comment about his '12 hour' delay? Other than the texting I'd say things are good but this is starting to really bug me now.

Sara; August 26, 2015 at 7:23 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Sara,
"he said maybe next weekend I can invite him to have a barbecue at my new place since it has a garden"

I wouldn't invite him to your home just yet - because it appears he's suggesting dates that will place you alone with him, possibly in a compromising position. Personally, I feel that a 4th date is still a tad too soon for that, but if you feel otherwise, you're free to do as you choose.

Another option would be to have the barbecue - and invite friends as well, so that there's a group present instead of just the two of you.

I also wouldn't do this because. . .he's attempting to place you into the position of initiator/leader. I really cannot stand when men do this. They make these silly suggestions to turn leadership over to the woman, while they lean back and take on the passive feminine role of submission. It's not a good look on a man if you ask me. I want a man who takes charge, not one who takes orders.

And when men do this and invite a woman to take the lead, and then she does and she begins to pursue him, contact him, ask him out, etc. - as HE INVITED HER TO DO - all of a sudden you then find the man pulling back suddenly and distancing himself from the pursuit of the woman. Sometimes even disappearing entirely.

It's like they set themselves up for this scenario to take place without even realizing it. And then once this exchange of roles takes place, they're clamoring for excuses not to see the woman, they take to labeling her "crazy" and their attraction for her diminishes. They don't even realize that THEY are the one's who set this up for failure.

I don't advocate chasing men, pursuing them, taking the lead, initiating contact with them, asking them out on dates, etc. for these very reasons. If a man is attempting to shift you into the role of "pursuer" to me, it's a red flag. The woman pursues, the man submits, he sleeps with her a few times and then all of a sudden you start to hear stuff like, "I need some space." Or, "This isn't working for me." Or, "This is moving too fast for me."

Yea - you need space pal because you're now feeling pressured under the pursuit that YOU ASKED FOR, and you're now feeling as if you're no longer in control of the pace of the relationship because YOU HANDED THE LEAD OVER TO THE WOMAN, instead of keeping that role for yourself so you could move the relationship along at stages.

And the end result is that the woman feels used sexually, she starts to experience self-doubt and begins to question what's wrong with her, what did she do wrong - and she ends up hurt and emotionally damaged as a result. . .all because she did what the guy ASKED HER TO DO.

I just simply do not believe that type of role reversal is good for any of the parties involved. If I were you, I'd place this barbecue on the back burner for another few weeks here and I wouldn't do any of the pursuing and II wouldn't be asking this man out on dates.

The only way a woman can know if a man is genuinely interested in her (and not just looking to get her alone so he can sleep with her) - is to see if HE pursues HER.

If he doesn't and he gets frustrated and walks away - then you have your answer. He wasn't genuinely interested and when he realized that getting laid wouldn't be so easy for him he bailed.

If he sticks around and continues to ask for dates, communicate, doesn't pressure for sex or alone time and keeps things moving forward, then there's an increased chance that he's genuinely interested in getting to know you as a person.; August 27, 2015 at 11:48 AM
miss J said...: Hello Mirrow, im in a LD relationship with my boyfriend. im Aries he is a Leo guy. A friend hooked us up in may 2013, at first it was a cold kind of communication then we really hit off in January 2014 and met in april 2014. its amazing, chemistry was fantastic. i was laid back then he did the chasing, spoiling me with gifts and was really taking care of me. A couple of times he tries to step out of the line but i always put him back to his place calmly with no drama at all. Fast forward 7mths later in the LDR in which he came to visit me 2 mores times, he professed he loved me twice but i couldnt bring myself to tell him back as i was scared of being hurt. We were always in contact but ofcourse the honeymoon phase of the R/ship was wearing off and i missed those times. But he was very nice still, always trying to make me happy. but then he started withdrawing when we had this fight and i threatened breakup. two days later, i apologized and we were back but afterwards he began withdrawing, i started feeling insecured so when he visited me again in dec, i began accused him of other girls and how i wonder what he was doing with me when im not his regular speck of girl. Insecurity played in big time, i began nagging and he withdraw. so i told him i was going to give him space, and he knew where to find me. i did the no contact rule for 30days after which when i reestablished contact in feb he was nice and happy and kept saying i was playing with his emotions he missed everything about me etc, he came to see me, we spent val together. when he left, he began acting cold again so i decide to do the monkey do monkey see style. he came 2 see me again 2mths later which happened to be our one year of serious dating and said he wanted things to be back to normal. he left and he was still not like he used to be all attentive. Then i called him to it and he said he changed because of my temper and attitude towards him, that i act like im longer interested in the r/ship but only using him to bid time pending when some else comes, and also im always too impatience and losing my temper with him after which i realize and come apologizing days later and that he didnt like it. I said ok, i would change and i very much want him in my life. one month later i asked him for something and he promised doing it the next week. when i keep reminding him of it he says he will do it until he finally gave me a flimsy lie of why he couldn't do it. i got pissed and did another 60days of no contact which i broke at 31 days because he lost his dad. I reached out and sent my condolences. 2wks later, i contacted him again and asked about the burial arrangements. i told him i missed him and missed us, he also wants things to get back to normal, then i told him i wanted to come for the burial, he said he may not have my time to be with me, i told him i was only coming for support. i went for the burial this last weekend, i was with for 2days and we stayed together in the same room. now i left, i just have this deep feelings of him taking me for granted and knowing i will always be there. he no longer takes care of my needs. i know he just lost is dad and don't want to put him under any pressure with demands, but i plan on breaking up with him this week or adopting the no contact rule when he contacts me again, because i haven't heard from him. please advice, im heart broken and i have crying at work since morning cus i love him. For some reasons i can no longer have that cool aloof demure around him which i use to have, now im always too excited in his presence and too chatty. And it makes him feel like oh cool i got her and when we become intimate, im always too conscious of not giving off the vibe i love him too much which also stops me from enjoying the moments unlike before where i was cool and calm but i opened myself to enjoying the feeling.; August 31, 2015 at 11:34 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA,

Hope you're doing well. I stumbled across your site about 2 years ago b/c I was an emotional mess with a FWB of mine. He had a girlfriend and he told me that they were in a open relationship and that he could see other people so I can still sleep with him. Like a dummy, I believed him, and just settled for him coming once every couple of months to sex me then go about his merry way. He knew I wanted more out of the arrangement, but he constantly gave excuse after excuse why we couldn't be together, but he said it could happen in the future. I was getting fed up with his bullshit so I just happened to come across your blog "dealing with a disappearing man" then I read this "when, why, how to use the no contact method" and after reading this blog I decided that NC would be the best option for me to get over this. I officially went to NC when my birthday came and I didn't hear from him. Any guilt that I had about going into NC went out the window when he didn't even have the decency to call or text me to wish me happy birthday. I didn't hear back from him until 2 weeks later at 2am -___-. Of course he got no response. He tried contacting me again 4 more times over a course of 7 months. And each contact was like nothing ever happened. So each time, no response. The last time he tried to contact me was July 26, 2014. So it's been over a year since the last attempt so I guess that meant he gave up. I was disappointed that he just stopped trying to reach out. But I learned a couple of months ago that he and his girlfriend now have a son together. So it would make sense why he would stop contacting me b/c around the end of July 2014 was when she got pregnant. Cheating on your girlfriend is already disrespectful but it's a whole 'nother level of disrespect if you cheat on her while she's pregnant. I'm not going to lie, I was disappointed when I learned about his new family he started, and it had to sink in with me that it's really over and I will never see him again.

Well, just recently, I have finally came to the conclusion that the love I thought I had for him was just lust and infatuation, and that has completely died. Before we got into this FWB arrangement, we were good friends for almost a year. I have finally reached a point that I don't want to be with him and I just miss our friendship that we had before this FWB crap came and ruined everything. I'm ok with just being his friend, not FWB, but strictly platonic friends. But my question is, do you think I should reach out to him and say I'm over you and I would like for us to work on being friends again? Or should I just keep doing what I'm doing and stay in NC until he reaches out to show he really misses me and wants me to be apart of his life? I just want a non-biased opinion on this situation.

Thanks in advance.; September 1, 2015 at 9:04 AM
Anonymous said...: Thanks mirror for your thoughts on what to do about the guy who resurfaced 3 years later!

I just realized though, perhaps *I* was the one who disappeared on him.

I was SO sure that he was the one who didn't reply my last e-mail (a long one about all my dating prospects at the time).... but curiosity led me to dig through 3 year old e-mail threads... and he DID reply that e-mail (and even helped analyze which guy I should choose!).

Then I continued the conversation saying I would reply his e-mail from a new e-mail account.

Went to that other e-mail account and could NOT find any further e-mails sent to him.

I was really hoping to pull out that single e-mail I sent him that he did not reply -- so I can go "ah ha! I have evidence he disappeared on me! no contact forever!"

But just going through previous e-mails, he has pinged me consistently whenever I would take over 3 weeks to reply. :-0

I am not emotionally invested as in... if he disappears again I'll be devastated. He was a great, genuine friend - and I hope it will always stay that way.

Lots of shtty men out there, but maybe sometimes the woman is at fault.

Though, HE thought he was the one to drop the ball on communication... based on that, perhaps he still deserves the same No Contact treatment?

- Vivian; September 1, 2015 at 5:10 PM
Chleo said...: Hi MOA

If you remember me, I was that girl who her partner left after she was very ill, and then he tried ostensvly to keep cpntact. I have to say I tried to stay away from him, and as time was moving on, I started to first haing him, and then to be completely indiferent. But I knew some days ago that he had gotten married with the woman with whom he betrayed me. It was strange, because he always told me that he wasn't the marrying type. This shouldn't disturb me, but I feel so hurt. I knew it y a mutual friend. I feel so used but I guess that's just life. Is it strange for me to feel very sad and angry at the same time with this? My friend told me that she thought it wasn't going to last long because they both say they are in a open relationship or marriage, whatever. MOA, do you think open relationships are an excuse for the man to not be faithful? He was never faithful and he always had an interest in exotic sexual practices, so to speak, which I didn't, so it was better we finished. I also wanted to ask if you think that parents or friends can help a person finish a relationship? I understand the decision to end the relationship was only his, but could his friends make pressure? All of his friends had the same tastes and I don't.
Thank you very much, MOA; September 2, 2015 at 3:01 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Sep 1, 9:04 AM,
"do you think I should reach out to him and say I'm over you and I would like for us to work on being friends again?"

In my opinion - no. For many reasons:

1) I feel this could potentially do great emotional harm to you by exposing yourself to him, a man you've had feelings for in the past, but have to deny yourself of. Why put yourself through that?

2) For him, there's a very high likelihood this won't be "just friends." If you pull yourself into his world again, after a while, he'll see an opportunity there. He cheated the first time, he'll cheat again. So how do you plan to fend off his advances? Do you have the strength to do so time and time again? And how will he react when he doesn't understand why (cause he may believe that's what you came back for)?

3) How will the girlfriend and mother of his child feel about an ex lover being present in their lives? Probably not good, and can you blame her? I mean. . .do you really want "static" and drama in your life?

4) Are you prepared to handle the self-doubt that exposure to this situation will inevitably cause? Are you strong enough to manage that and work through it? What will you do when questions start creeping into your mind as you watch him with his new child? Questions such as, "Why didn't he want this with me? "What's wrong with me, why can't I have this, too?" "Why did he start a family with her while he was involved with me?" "Why didn't he want a family with me?"

I don't see any of that as really being worth the trouble :-( There are simply way too many variables that could take a wild turn at any given moment and cause major regrets.

"Or should I just keep doing what I'm doing and stay in NC until he reaches out to show he really misses me and wants me to be apart of his life?"

I'd keep doing no contact - and consider him a part of your past, no longer waiting for him to reach out.

Accept that the situation is no longer the same. His life is no longer the same. His situation is no longer the same. He's moved on. He has a new family. He has a child and a whole new slew of fatherly responsibilities. There is no going back. He's gone :-(

The situation has changed completely and it was only a "situation" every few months or so anyway - so really, how good of a friend could this man have possibly been anyway? Bee-bopping in and out of someone's life when it's convenient for you, using them, and then disappearing until the next time you need to use them. . .that's not the definition of friendship at all.

He's been gone a year, and you've already gotten past the hurdle of the hardest part. . .so why dredge up the dead and put yourself into an awkward situation and risk setting yourself back emotionally with someone who was only making appearances in your life when it was convenient for HIM anyway?; September 3, 2015 at 6:05 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Chloe,
Sometimes things just aren't meant to be. And when they aren't meant to be, it's best to pull something positive out of the experience and look at it as a valuable "lesson learned."

Open relationships aren't my bag, and quite frankly they don't make an ounce of sense to me at all. If you're going to behave as if you're single when in a relationship - then aren't you just single anyway? And if you're going to behave as if you're single when in a relationship, why are you even IN a relationship? And if you want to sleep around - why on earth would you get married? It just doesn't make an ounce of sense to me LOL.

To me, relationships = commitment. I mean, isn't that what they're about? And without a commitment, as far as I'm concerned - there IS no relationship because each party is still operating as an uncommitted single individual. In the end, an "open relationship" to me really means - I'm single, but there is a "regular" in my life. And if I wanted an open relationship, the last thing on earth I would do is march down the aisle and tie the know LOL.

But that's just me. And for some people, this works. I think that's a small percentage of the population but hey, to each his own - whatever works.

It'll be interesting to see how the woman in this situation handles this long term now that a formal marriage is in place. Wouldn't surprise me at all if she secretly expects "more" from him now (commitment), and 3-4 years down the road gets fed up with this "arrangement" and false marriage.

People can influence your relationships and decisions - when YOU LET THEM.

If an individual really doesn't know what they want, they can be easily swayed by others. But if an individual knows strongly what they want, they can't be swayed. So in the end, it amounts to the individual themselves regarding whether or not they can be influenced by others.

If i were you - I'd be SO THANKFUL this situation is finally over. I feel everyone deserves someone special, and no one should have to settle for less or share their special someone with everyone else.

Be glad you're not her. Be glad you're not married to this man.; September 3, 2015 at 6:18 PM
Fire&Water said...: OK I just need to vent...ladies, thank you in advance for permitting me the privilege!
I haven't contacted, talked to or seen A in around 3 months. I figure we're done, no big. I'm good. So, I stopped by his office to leave a joke for my friend K. I didn't see him, but she must have shown it to him after because in half an hour, I get a text message "Hysterical, loved it. Thanks so much. Your the best". Seriously, wtf?! Why do guys do shix like this? Why on earth would you ignore someone, not reach out to them for months, act like you couldn't give a crap about them...and then send them a text thanking them for something they didn't do for you? And guys think women are crazy? I haven't answered and won't, but good grief, ya know? WTH.; September 4, 2015 at 4:21 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA

This is Sara if you remember...

So we went on our 5th date on Sunday and it was a 'movie' at home date which I felt ready for.

Here's the issue though. It's been a month and five dates which happen every Sunday so far because he's doing this project that's finishing next week and spends all day in the workshop - even Sundays- because he's doing a demanding postgraduate degree.

Therefore our dates are spaced out and our communication is him initiating on the Wednesday after our Sunday date to see how I am and then this texting usually continuing the next day because he drops out of the conversation at some point and replies the next day. My first question is - what do I do about that?

Then he might text me again on the Friday and then I'll text him on the Sunday and meanwhile he'll suggest we go out. That's the pattern so far.

Also for example tonight, we were texting because I had big news about sth so I shared it with him and at some point along the conversation he stopped texting, replied 3,5 hours later and I then replied an hour later commenting on what he said and wishing him goodnight. I have closure to the conversation which doesn't happen which upsets me. Am I demanding to expect closure to the conversation? He hasn't opened that last text of mine and therefore I won't get a goodnight from him. That bothers me too. What do I do?

Also what about phone calls? After five dates couldn't a phone call come into play? I had my birthday last week and he sent me a happy birthday text rather than call me... It's turned into a situation where I couldn't imagine us chatting on the phone.

I want a serious relationship with someone and I don't know what to do with him. I don't know whether to call it a day or change behavior and see?

Thanks! :-); September 8, 2015 at 7:37 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Sara,
"our dates are spaced out and our communication is him initiating on the Wednesday after our Sunday date to see how I am and then this texting usually continuing the next day because he drops out of the conversation at some point and replies the next day. My first question is - what do I do about that?"

Nothing. Mirror that behavior every once in a while yourself, and don't consider him your boyfriend. Keep your options open. You're only casually dating at this point. Communication will be sporadic and irregular as will dates as a result.

Nothing can be expected, regular or committed - until a commitment is actually in place.

"Am I demanding to expect closure to the conversation? He hasn't opened that last text of mine and therefore I won't get a goodnight from him. That bothers me too. What do I do?"

Lower your expectations a bit and you won't be so distressed. You're projecting "committed" expectations onto him, like that of a boyfriend. And when he doesn't reciprocate, you're disappointed.

That conversation closure and those goodnights are things that committed couples do. When you're only casually dating, and the man hasn't professed his love for you and asked for a commitment as a result - you can't expect him to do the things that boyfriends do.

"Also what about phone calls? After five dates couldn't a phone call come into play? I had my birthday last week and he sent me a happy birthday text rather than call me... It's turned into a situation where I couldn't imagine us chatting on the phone."

Next time he texts, respond with "Hey, I have some free time right now - why don't you give me a call and we can chat a bit." Just throw that out there and plant the seed, then see if he runs with it.

"I want a serious relationship with someone and I don't know what to do with him. I don't know whether to call it a day or change behavior and see?"

Well, as you know, we can't control others. We can only control our reaction to them. And you also have to realize that relationships take time to grow. I know we like to speed things along as women, but the truth is that love takes time to grow. An investment of 5 dates over the course of 5 weeks really isn't all that much time. Most couples start to experience feelings of love around the 3 - 4 month mark, with men taking even a bit longer at around the 4 - 6 month mark.

But if you're unhappy, and you don't feel this man cares to move the relationship along - then you walk away from him. You can't change him. You can't control him. But you CAN use your free will to remove yourself from a situation that isn't making you happy, so that you can find one that is ;-); September 9, 2015 at 6:08 PM
Anonymous said...: HI MOA! Me and my GF were together for 5 1/2 years. She broke up with me 2 months ago. Her reason is that she's not sure if she can be committed to the relationship and if this is really what she wants. She said she still cares for me. She wants to stay friends. We still talked most of the time through texting. We even hang out at least once a week. It's like we're together but we're not. I asked her what am I gonna get out of this. She said at this moment we are just friends. I'm scared that she'll be too comfortable with me being in the "friend-zone." So I told her just few days ago I will make her fall in love with me again. She said she's not sure and that it's not the right time. I told her I don't care and that I will fight for it. She said ok maybe. I told her I'm gonna take her out next week and we'll have a date. So I started reading blogs and a book about following the "No Contact Rule" and how to get back your ex.

Last night, I texted my ex-GF apologizing for being an emotional wreck and that I wish her good luck and for her to take care of herself. I was never explicit in my text that I will not contact her anymore.
The following day she texted me good morning and that she understand.
I did not reply.
She texted me again asking me if I'm okay.
I did not reply.
She texted me again "Are you not gonna talk to me anymore? :/"
I still have not replied.
She texted "Can u at least let me know so I'm not all wondering?"
Still no reply from me.
She texted "I still wanna see u next week if that's OK or no?"
No reply from me.
And her last text was ":'( :'( :'("
So I still haven't replied to her.

At this moment, I'm not really sure what's going on. Does she still love me? Does she wants us to just be friends? Will I get her back? And should I continue the "No contact rule"? Or should I just text her back and go with my original plan on making her fall in love with me again. I don't know what to do. I do love her very much and I want to be with her. Thank you; September 12, 2015 at 5:49 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Sep 12, 5:49 AM,
"should I just text her back and go with my original plan on making her fall in love with me again. I don't know what to do."

But isn't no contact part of that plan? I mean - it's a known fact that people always want what they can't have. And she's becoming desperate in those texts because she's realizing that she can no longer have you. So. . .isn't that exactly what you've set out to do? It appears that no contact is working. It just needs to play out for a full 30 days.

"Does she still love me? Does she wants us to just be friends? Will I get her back?"

You will have the answers to these questions once you complete the 30 days of no contact. And if you don't have the answers by then, you'll at least have a much better idea of where you stand with her, how important to her you are, and whether or not you should even attempt to carry on with her.; September 15, 2015 at 8:42 AM
Anonymous said...: Good Morning Mirror. This is AlabamaGirl

I wrote a while back about me being hospitalized for a long period of time and my boyfriend (a self-proclaimed commitment phobic) needing space several months afterwards. I signed as “Wondering” for that post.

Anyway, we broke up June 17 and last spoke (I called him) June 26. I have not initiated contact with him since then. He initiated only 3 very casual texts, the last one being about a month ago which I did reply to. It was very casual. “Hope you’re doing well, etc. No mention of “I miss you” or anything like that. I ended the conversation first.

I have started talking to another man who is definitely pursuing me. He’s not really my type but he’s fun and flirty and he’s a nice man. I’m talking to another man on a dating website. My ex boyfriend is on the same site.

This morning I came out of the doctor’s office (we use the same doctor for hormone replacement) and he was parked right next to my car. He was listening to a news broadcast or something because it was loud. He had his windows rolled up. Needless to say, I was very surprised when I saw his car. He waved and I bent down just enough to see him and wave back. He didn’t even turn down the broadcast or even roll the window down. After returning the casual wave, I got back in my car.

As I was pulling out of the parking space, he turned around to watch me leave, as if he was surprised that I had pulled out. (He was still sitting in his car.) Did he think I would come over to his side of the car and attempt to talk?

After everything we’ve been through, how could he not even roll his window down and speak to me?
And…why even pull in the parking space right next to me in the first place when he knew it was my car? He could have waited until I left and then pulled in. (He gets a hormone shot each week and it doesn’t require an appointment.) If he had waited until I left, I would not have even seen him and he would not have had to see me, just my car parked in front of the building.

I just don’t understand it at all… I know I am not over this man yet and seeing him today has confirmed it, but I did not initiate any conversation with him since he didn’t initiate first. I just got back in my car and drove back to work.

What do you think? Obviously he wanted me to see him (and he wanted to see me?) or he would have waited until I left?? Maybe if he had a conversation with me, due to his phobia, he would think that he “owes” me more in the relationship? I just don’t know!

I hope you can reply soon.; September 15, 2015 at 12:28 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror
I really wanted you to know how much helpfull crossing your road could have been to me.
And how precious reading your advices here..all the comments left under your articles..the books you've recommanded these last days too..have cleared my mind and lightened my way through the relationship I was living.
2 months ago I was writting to you, dealing with an Alpha reappearing disappearing man that suddendly wanted a break on our relation.
You cleverly told me to go into a no contact process ..then to admit that maybe the whole thing was over and to move foreward.
Regularly...every 8 to 10 days...he wrote to me a little something and I followed the 3O days rule, remaining totally silent during the first month and answering on a short and neutral basis since 3 weeks to his emails, taking one on 4 phone calls, making the point on not contacting him first.
I am amazed how things go following your decription and what I've read in the Sherry Argov 's book.
After a month, the tone of his e mails began to change, from " I can't see you/ I won't talk to you for a while/ I am trying to recover" to "Damned I miss you/ I think of you everyday".
I guess after a month he began to wonder if I was dating someone else, or if I was over him. And now he is finally experiencing the miss (at least!!! ;D )
I wish I would have read of these advices before the breakout!!! The way I react the day we broke up still make me feel pretty shamefull :/
Cont....; September 15, 2015 at 12:34 PM
Anonymous said...: I totally fall appart in front of him.
Crying, begging, pleading.
Go silent. No contact. Take the time to calm down emotions..can't anyone teach us that in high school??!!!!!
I feel incresingly empowered since I read you and the authors you advise me.
I have also discovered an handsome guy name Matthew Hussey and his youtube channel and picked some of his tricks to date and talk to men.
Meanwhile, I took these no contact months to reassure myself. Got a new hair style. A new pencil skirt and an amazing pair of stilettos. Had a few talks online with nice guys. Met one during a brunch in a casual date.
Nothing serious..but I feel pretty confident and that's the main point!
I still don't know if we are going to see each other again...I wouldn't say that i don't care but I know now that if he comes back, I will meet the "new and impoved" me.
The Nice girl has called it quit!
I still will be soft and feminine but I won't give a man the feeling that I am needy, sooo into him, fullh conquered, and I will stay firm on my standards!
With this man..even if as you've mentionned that I am not sure to want him if he comes back in a few weeks.
And with all the others..Mister Right included.
Mirror...you are my mentor!!!
;D
Virginie; September 15, 2015 at 12:35 PM
Anonymous said...: @ Mirror
From AlabamaGirl

Got a text today from CP man. He apologized about yesterday. He said right at the moment that I came out of the doctor’s office he was on a phone call that he had patched through his bluetooth in his car. He was getting some “very upsetting” news he said regarding a former boss of his. (I know she had some health problems when we were together and he thinks of her as a second mother.) Said he couldn’t get off the call right at that moment to get my attention to let me know he wanted to talk. And that he tried to wave as I was leaving (guess that’s when he turned around) but since I left, he thought I didn’t want to talk to him.

I told him I understood and hoped his old boss would be ok. While I was at it, I told him I had read a book on commitment phobia and had a better understanding about things that had happened in the past and hoped he would talk to a professional about it. (It’s sabotaging his life in other ways, not just his romantic relationships).

His reply was “so I guess that answers the question of whether I am commitment phobic or you are.” (Didn’t really get that “or you are.”) Anyway, he said “I am glad to know that we both agree that yesterday was not really what it seemed and that we can actually talk and visit and catch up if we run into each other again like we did yesterday!!” I replied, yes, bye (his name)

Ugh! I was so hoping he would want to get together and talk. I know I must move on with my life, but my heart still hurts, I miss him still, and I’m almost in tears…again. I was doing so much better until I saw him out of the blue yesterday.

Somehow deep in my spirit I feel it’s not over between us and that it will work out in the end. Nevertheless, his actions indicate otherwise. How can he just put a halt to what we shared and went through together? How do men just turn off their emotions like that, leave a good woman and a good relationship behind, and look for someone else?; September 16, 2015 at 2:31 PM
Anonymous said...: Hello all - I just thought I'd stop by and give an update on my situation. I attended an event this past weekend where I thought I may run into my guy friend but he wasn't there. I admit I was disappointed, however, I'm happy to report I still had a great time! I met up with other friends and we ended up having dinner and catching up over drinks so the perfect ending to what could have been an excuse for me to be depressed all evening.

I am now on day 18 of NC - he initiated our last text exchange, which wasn't terribly involved, a little over two weeks ago, and I allowed it to end when he sent a message across that didn't really warrant a response (as a reminder, he has not done anything 'bad' - I am just trying to get over him and get back to friendship feelings). To be honest, I'm struggling. It's not that I want to reach out to him everyday but a couple of little, funny things have happened that I have really wanted to share with him. I do miss him and our interactions...but I remind myself that if he felt the same way, he would be showing it with actions. I am happy to report that a few days ago I found myself falling into 'planning' what I would do at the 30 day mark and instead have focused my attention to more useful pasttimes.

So onward I go...but happy to hear pointers from those of you who have made it through successfully...I'm really hoping that in another 2-3 weeks I won't be thinking about 'what to do' if I don't hear from him. I am trying to focus on trusting that whatever is meant to be will be.

Cancer Leo; September 23, 2015 at 10:34 AM
loretta said...: Hey Cancer Leo. The whole "NC" thing is such a burden. I find myself thinking more about that than just getting on with my life. I decided to get on with my life and so I broke the NC with Casual Guy by forwarding him a business related email. He responded to it right away, and seemed pretty relieved I finally contacted him after almost 2 weeks.

I don't have the space in my head to burden it with thinking about no contact. I suspect the person doing it is much more obsessed than the person receiving it. So, don't waste your time. Just move on with your life without even thinking about him anymore. It's not "no contact" anymore. It's just goodbye.; September 23, 2015 at 2:31 PM
Chleo said...: Hi again Mirror, and thank you for answering me. Unfortunately I am still very sad with my ex's marriage, although I am starting to think that it became a co-dependency story, not a love one. The main reason for that is that I have a weak physical health and I also have Asperger Syndrome, and that made me put up with many things throughtout this relationship, that I wouldn't accept in a normal situation. He was my first partner and I honestly thought that due to my difficulties, I would never be able to find another person so I should be grateful he wanted to spend time with me. The syndrome is mostly noticeable in social contexts and that makes my chances of finding a partner, less than the majority of ladies. I am honestly confused about a specfic subject: I am thinking if it will be a good idea to be upfront with a date and tell him what I am, but I am terribly afraid I will be alone all my life. What do you think Mirror? Throught my experience, the majority of men got almost disgusted with my physical illness ( chronic illness) and I also have Asperger. Do you think this will be a problem and when do you think I should tell them without scarying them?

Thank you Mirror. Please keep up with this blog :); September 28, 2015 at 1:51 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Chleo
"I have a weak physical health and I also have Asperger Syndrome. . .I am thinking if it will be a good idea to be upfront with a date and tell him, but I am terribly afraid I will be alone all my life. What do you think Mirror?"

I think that you lead with your good qualities when getting to know someone, and you don't expose your bad ones immediately to absolute strangers. Because that type of information in the wrong hands (the hands of a bad, ignorant guy) can do a serious amount of damage.

So you don't give strangers stuff that they can use as "ammo" against you. You save that stuff for people that have already proven that they like you for who you are - those that have stuck around a while, and continue to come around, proving that they're genuinely interested and showing a bit of loyalty. Because once someone likes you for who you are. . .they don't sweat the small stuff, and they don't make a bigger deal out of the big stuff. Instead, they support you - because they like you no matter what. They like you for who you are, and any perceived "flaws" that you feel you may have - they'll accept regardless:-)

It's not necessary for you to bare your soul to strangers in order to receive love. Love is unconditional. Animals show us that. They love you regardless of the color of your skin. They love you regardless of the fact that you can't spend all day with them. And they love you even when you don't love yourself. That type of love is unconditional - it's not provided under certain conditions only. It simply exists - always.

And once you find the right person for you - they will love you in the same manner.; September 29, 2015 at 5:48 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi MOA

I need your advice please! I had been dating this guy for a month and we went out about once a week because he was very busy. On the 4th date we slept with each other and we had five dates in total (last one was two weeks ago). He had warned me from a while back that when his parents visit him from a country very far away...he would not be able to see me at all for those 11 days (they are here till next week). Also he was meeting a difficult deadline until this last Monday and so he would have a 2 day gap between his parents coming and meeting the deadline so he said he wanted us to meet.

We arranged both days but both days he cancelled because his work was prolonged. It had already been over a week since I last saw him by then and so I realised that by the time I woudl see him again (when his parents leave) 3 weeks will go by in total. This disappointed me and it felt really dumb as we were still really fresh and why not meet me for a quick coffee when his parents are here? In any case I said to myself lets see how much he keeps in touch at least...

Until then our communication was limited to texting as he had shown clear avoidance of calls. The texting was almost on a daily basis. But since he cancelled our two arrangements mid last week he hasn't kept the communication up. I texted him this past Sunday to say hi and he was friendly HOWEVER I noticed that he had his phone switched off and just switched it on to quickly reply to me.... then I realised he had done the same on the day his parents came last Thursday which is something he didn't do before and so I figured he's been switching his phone off ever since they came....are you getting me MOA?

Then everything started clicking today after all this time of not hearing from him on his own initiative....switched off phone/ persistently reminding me that when his parents visit I can't see him/ not inviting me to the exhibition of his work today when he had invited me a month ago when I met him/ the general unavailability during weekday evenings when I had suggested we meet once and he said he was working late..../ his very fast and anxious departure the two mornings we woke up together saying he had to get to the workshop (at 7:30am!!)..../the large number of notifications that came up on his phone in the mornings we woke up together/ the avoidance of showing any public interest in me on facebook (with likes etc)... so I am thinking he has a long distance relationship from back home that he has been hiding from me and she has come to visit him now.

My questions now are (1) How do I respond to him when he gets back in touch after his ''parents'' leave next week after this long period of face to face and texting unavailability (2) How do I generally deal with this guy who has been super busy since I started dating him but kept me interested because he said that once the deadline is over and then his parents leave we will finally spend more time together (which seems unlikely now that he hasn't even kept up the texting) (3) How do I deal with my own emotions that are moving from anger and betrayal and the desire to lash out at him and then thinking no its best to play it cool and make him think I'm not even that bothered..... (4) How do I turn the tables if its worth it? Do I go no contact on him??

I would really appreciate your wise input on this MOA :-)

Rose88; September 29, 2015 at 7:05 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Rose88,
"How do I respond to him when he gets back in touch after his ''parents'' leave next week after this long period of face to face and texting unavailability"

Well that depends - on how you feel with this revelation. If you don't feel like responding, then don't force yourself to. If you are curious, then you can respond, but remain vague and non-committal and don't make any promises.

In otherwords, it's time to pull back on this and apply the brakes a bit to safeguard yourself (and to observe his actions, or lack thereof, a bit more).

"How do I generally deal with this guy who has been super busy since I started dating him but kept me interested because he said that once the deadline is over and then his parents leave we will finally spend more time together (which seems unlikely now that he hasn't even kept up the texting)"

That too will depend on how you now feel with this new information. If it were me, I'd probably put him to the test to ferret out what, if anything, is going on here. Meaning, the only time I WOULD be available to him, is during the evenings during the week LOL. I'd purposefully make things a bit difficult for him so that I could observe what he does, how he handles it, etc.

"How do I deal with my own emotions that are moving from anger and betrayal and the desire to lash out at him and then thinking no its best to play it cool and make him think I'm not even that bothered"

You listen to your feelings and you pull back and put the brakes on a bit to give yourself some space to process where your emotions eventually end up. I wouldn't lash out. I wouldn't play your cards like that. The less he knows about what's going on with you right now, the more time you have to observe his actions, gather more information, and reach your own definitive conclusions.

"How do I turn the tables if its worth it? Do I go no contact on him?"

Yep. And it's not to draw him closer to you - it's to yank away power from him, control that he feels he may have over you, and to safeguard yourself.

Because if he's doing what you suspect he's doing, then chances are he's feeling quite powerful and in control and this is bringing him joy on some level. If you yank that away from him, he's not so joyous anymore, he's not so powerful anymore and he is definitely not in control anymore.

Normally, I probably wouldn't think too much of him turning off his phone when parents are in town. I'm not sure what his cultural background is, but hey - maybe that's a sign of respect.

But in this situation, it's the combination of all the questionable things and behavior you've listed that is cause for a red flag. It's not just one thing - it's a bunch of them. And that means it's time to put the brakes on. It's time to gather information and insights by observing what he does and how he acts after this time with his parents passes, and after he's no longer got so much control over this situation.

His actions after this period are over are probably going to tell you a LOT. So steady yourself for them, and be prepared. Don't dismiss anything, and focus on everything. If things don't add up - then the answer becomes even more clear.; October 1, 2015 at 5:31 PM
loretta said...: Hey Rose88 - are you dating Casual Guy? LOL. It sounds just like him, except he didn't have a mail order bride visiting him. He was just so incommunicative and gave such mixed messages. I suspect as MoA has written about before, that he has a "secret" life that he is keeping from you. Now that he knows what you're like in bed (so that mystery is gone), he may not be that eager to court you anymore. Most of them don't.

However, I am so fed up with this, that if I were you (and you can ignore me), the next time he contacts me I would ignore it. In fact, I'd ignore him with ice around the edges for 2 weeks. That's all it will take to turn it around. And then, respond to the last time he contacted you (via text, most likely), with "GFY!"

That's shorthand for Go F Yourself.

I wouldn't give him the time of day as far as the romance is concerned. If you have to work with him, that requires a different kind of cool, and you don't burn any bridges. But, I do not hesitate anymore to tell guys to go fly a kite if they act like jerks. He is a jerk.; October 1, 2015 at 6:43 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror, I've been seeing a guy for a couple of weeks now. We met a couple of months ago and slept together and more recently we've been dating. We even agreed not to have sex while we started dating properly so he could prove to me he wasn't just with me for that reason. We've not putting any labels on our relationship but we've agreed we're not sleeping with anyone else so now that we're physical again, we've stopped using protection. He constantly tells me how he has experienced a switch and how much more he likes and respects me now. I hear from him everyday. I let him do the chasing so he has been texting, ringing first or initiating the dates. Because it was going well, I invited him to a date and occasionally I text him first. However, this last week it feels like something has changed. He has gone on holiday with a male friend on the same week that I have gone away with work. I was supposed to spend the night with him before I went away but it got late and he went to bed. Since we've both been away I have not heard from him as often, if he does message he ends the message with "catch you later", or "have a good trip". It's making me a little anxious so I initiated a date for when we get back and he hasn't replied. Do you think this is sizzling out or do you think he just wants space while he's away? I don't understand what's caused the shift. Have I done something wrong?; October 2, 2015 at 9:00 AM
Unknown said...: Hello, Does the NO CONTACT RULE works on a lady that I was seeing? The reason we broke off the dating/seeing was because I was too clingy, hopes too high, and treat her like a gf too fast, she felt pressured because shes still not completely over her ex, and I realize I messed it up by being too rush. I was always there for her when she felt miserable and sad because of what her ex did to her, took her out, dinners, concerts, movies, drinks, have fun times, even little things like walking with her dog. But since I messed up by pushing too fast, She's at a point that she doesn't want anything from me right now. So my last conversation with her was 4 days ago. I haven't logged on Social Media at all because I deleted my smart phone Apps of all social media apps that involves with her so I don't get distracted if she ever text me. And also if she ever log on to see my profile, it will show how long I was gone for and how long I haven't signed on. The dating/seeing relationship lasted 2 months. So will this tactic work on her? Please kindly help, please advise thank you so much!; October 3, 2015 at 1:24 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Unknown,
"Does the NO CONTACT RULE works on a lady that I was seeing?"

There's no way to predict how an individual will respond to NC. I believe that while NC can work to draw someone's attention again, it's real benefit is that it helps the individual using it to emotionally detach, so that they can get back to a place of emotional balance and stability once again. How the other individual reacts really depends on their level of interest. If they're genuinely interested, chances are they'll circle around to touch base after a period of silence. If they're not genuinely interested, they may simply leave things as they are. It really all depends on their level of interest.; October 3, 2015 at 12:24 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Oct 2, 9:00 AM,
"seeing a guy for a couple of weeks now. . .we've stopped using protection"

Why have you made this decision? Meaning - why are you risking your future on a man who is giving you nothing besides a bit of his time right now? You don't know where he's been in the past, or who he's been with. You could come in contact the HPV virus, you could come in contact with an STD. You could become pregnant to this man - a man who has yet to make a full commitment to you "emotionally" - meaning - he has not professed that he's in love with you. You've only know him for a few months - are you prepared for the reality that this man could become the father of your child? Is he a man you'd even want to raise a child with? Is he a man that would even stick around should that happen?

I mean no disrespect - but I am concerned that you're not thinking far enough ahead here, and instead, you're living in the moment which can be very risky and dangerous to your future.

"I initiated a date for when we get back and he hasn't replied."

See what I mean? This guy could bolt on you - for whatever reason. He does not deserve that type of investment from you (risking your future), when he's not risking anything himself.

"I don't understand what's caused the shift. Have I done something wrong?"

No - you've done nothing wrong here. But - you DO need to think about this, and you DO need to take actions to protect yourself. Since he's now become ignorant and he's not replying to you, when he returns and he does make contact with you - he gets NO RESPONSE. No matter how many times he contacts you, questions you, asks what's wrong or why you're not responding. . .you do NOT respond to him until he either 1) apologies for treating you poorly, or 2) ask for a "talk."

If neither of those 2 things happens - he gets no response.

Because he's now starting to take it (you) for granted that, no matter what he does and no matter how he treats you, that you'll still be there, willing and waiting on him. And you cannot permit him to treat you in this manner by accepting this behavior because if you do - you'll only get more of it.

Don't worry about the "why" here - why he's done this or why he's gone silent. Forget about worrying about him or focusing on him or thinking about him. Instead, focus on what's really important here - which is YOU and your emotional well being, and your future. Take the action of distancing yourself to protect yourself - and observe his next few moves without reacting or responding. . .because they will tell you A LOT. And you will then have more information to make an informed decision for yourself about your future.; October 3, 2015 at 1:51 PM
Anonymous said...: Hello all - an update on day 28 of NC for me...I'm almost there!! As a reminder, my sitiuation is a little different in that this man didn't do something that he needs to apologize for. Basically I jumped the gun and told him I would be interested in exploring more with him but then realized that he likely isn't interested and that I need to detach emotionally if I ever want to have a friendship with him. I honestly don't know what I'm feeling right now other than acknowledging that I do miss our interactions. There have been a couple of things that have happened where my immediate thought has been "oh, I'll have to tell him about that, that was funny!" and then I remember NC. Fortunately I've restrained myself.

I do have one question for the group though - when exchanging electronic communications, do you keep the back and forth going? What I'm getting at is he initiated our last text exchange (he initiated over 70% of them before my little "I have feelings for you" discussion). I responded to his message and he responded back to me. I let the exchange end at that point because there wasn't anything specific for me to respond to and honestly, at some point, all conversations end. So I guess my question is if/when I decide to go ahead and reach out, is that me pursuing him? I think where I'm getting tripped up here is that what was a friendship turned into more for me so now I don't feel as comfortable reaching out to him as a friend, and I'm worried that he will perceive it as me chasing him.

Does anyone have any thoughts or experiences here? Is it worth me trying to be friends with him or am I just kidding myself?
Cancer Leo; October 3, 2015 at 3:04 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror. I have a distance relations with a boy. We have never met but had quite warm relations. He tried not to let me go and expressed attention, even panning to meet one day. Almost every day he was dropping me some text to show his presence. One day he disappeared for three weeks without any sign and just appeared asking what i am doing as if nothing happened. I turned on NC rule. he messaged me again telling he is sure I am mad at him, but his phone was broken and he could not communicate for that reason (I am sure he could contact by any mean) . after an hour of no response he wrote that if i don't want to communicate with him he will understand and if i have a new boyfriend he will understand as well. How you think. Is the rule working or is he going to disappear permanently after those words.; October 7, 2015 at 6:17 PM
Anonymous said...: Hello, Mirror.
I've been reading your posts and the comments for days, since my breakup, and I think you're amazing.
In fact, I was so intent on reading all the comments, I didn't even know if you were still (ie NOW, in October 2015) still replying to people. I am so happy I have just jumped ahead to the 'newest' comments to discover that you are indeed still around and still replying!!! :-) xxx

I really hope you can offer me some advice, for even though I've read a lot, and understand it, I feel as though my situation is just ever so slightly different and so I'm not sure if I've done the right thing.

I'm not sure if I should tell you my whole story from the beginning or just the recent part. I think I will just tell you the recent part, and see what you think.

Here goes:

In April, I heard from a guy that I have a past with. We went out a few times but for one reason or another, it wasn't for long (mostly because he was rather flaky). The last time we went out, was for a few weeks in 2013, but he ended it (for no real reason)... then every few months for TWO YEARS he would email me saying he's sorry he didn't give it more of a go.
Anyway, in April this year, he emailed me again, and I finally decided why not, to give him another go. I was feeling empowered and all that, and was single and willing to see if we could finally find out if we would make a good couple. (He turned 45 in April, the week he contacted me, and then in August I turned 38).

Anyway, he was in another state for a couple of months, so it was pretty much just text messaging and the occasional phone call as our 'courting', our re-igniting the interest. Lots of sweet messages about wanting to be snuggled on the lounge together (it was winter) and looking forward to a time where we could have dinner together, be together, etc. In that time he was away, we did meet up, twice - the first time was very significant as it was our first meeting in two years! He came back to my city (where his home is) for one night, for a special event, and took me as his plus-one, where he introduced me as his girlfriend. We had a night in a fancy hotel and it was very amazing and of course we were very passionate and had s*x, etc.
But it was just for one night, of course, as he had to go back to his temporary work assignment in another state. A couple of weeks later, we had arranged to meet in a different city, where he was going for a trade show. I flew down and met him, we had a fun weekend in a hotel, went out for lunches and dinners, and even had dinner with a couple of his friends in that city, where he introduced me as his girlfriend, practically as his 'partner'.; October 10, 2015 at 4:59 AM
Anonymous said...: Once that weekend was over, he went back to the temporary job in another state, for the last five weeks of that job assignment. It was hard to wait the five weeks till he got back to my city, where he lives, but we had plenty of lovely texts and the occasional phone call (nothing too long and deep though),
OK, so, he finally comes back home after the job. And that first weekend, I went to his sister's birthday dinner, with other friends of his, and we spent the whole weekend together. And he even gave me a key to his place! I was shocked, it felt like such a fast move, but I didn't question it.
I figured he must have been serious about me.
We fell into a pattern of seeing each other pretty much just two nights a week, because of my weird work schedule (I do quite a few late night finishes and have other commitments). I never pushed for more time together. He seemed to reeally enjoy having me come round and he would cook really nice meals (he loved cooking).
Initially we talked about travelling together (particularly to New York, somewhere we'd both love to go).. but over time, he stopped mentioning that sort of thing. I figured it was because he is not working at the moment, looking for new work, and I was kinda holding back on making plans or suggesting we go out much, because I knew money was a bit tight until he gets more work. (He works in creative roles, where the work is often for a few months at a time, but sporadic).; October 10, 2015 at 5:00 AM
Anonymous said...: Anyway, we never fought, we always had a nice time, but I felt like nothing was really happening. It was 'nice' but I also felt like he wasn't 100% in it, like he could sort of take me or leave me. Even though he was kind and affectionate (though not as much as I would like. I mean, he didn't like kissing as much as I did, and I would often feel that s*x was all about him. And it was always s*x, not 'making love'. Oh, and he never ever said that he loved me.
Anyway, I was starting to feel like something was just not quite right, when suddenly he annouced one night when i went for dinner that he was going to go away for a week. I wasn't invited, it was a week away so that he could 'get out of the city and clear my head, work out a few things'. I was a bit upset, especially as we'd not yet even made plans to do anything together, but I was happy for him to sort his own thing out. I always gave him space and never tried to crowd him, and i am busy anyway.
But I could sense his weird vibe before I went away, so I confronted him and said, "I just feel like you're going to go away for a week then come back and break up with me'. Well, I'm glad I brought it up because as soon as I said that, he admitted that he's been feeling unsure about me for a while and he just 'couldn't see a future with me'. And he feels like he just hasn't met the right person yet, etc. And I was so hurt because we've not been together long, and after two years of him supposedly trying to pursue me to go out with him, how could he decide so soon that it wasn't right?! Especially when I had been trying to do the right thing, not pressuring him, just enjoying his company until he finds more work.
Anyway, I have learnt enough from the past to know not to try to convince someone to be with me if they don't want to, so we broke up that morning. It was horrible. We both cried.
But we said we would talk again when he got back from his week away.
It was a difficult week.; October 10, 2015 at 5:00 AM
Anonymous said...: But when he got back, we met up for lunch. It was very sad but I thought it was the most emotionally mature breakup I've been through. He admitted he'd had trouble making a decision but ultimately decided that we shouldnt' stay together, that he doesnt' think he's ready for a relationship, that he needs to be alone for quite a while, and probably needs some therapy/counselling.
I was upset but I explained I'd learnt a lot in the week apart, about my role in the relationship and about what I want, too.
Anyway, we said goodbye, it was hard but I felt it was right. And although I had up and down days, and cried and was angry and upset, I started moving on....
AND THEN HE EMAILED ME ONLY ONE WEEK LATER! Actually, just less than a week. It sounded really casual, like, 'How have you been? I've had a sh*t week since we last spoke, etc' and telling me how he had a really boring time at the new job he just started. (He just started working at the building next door to where I work, which is a job he will be at for one month. He knew he was going to be doing that, before he broke up with me.)
So, that email ended with him saying 'I wonder if we can talk soon? Tomorrow or the next day?' but he didn't say why.
I didn't reply, because it was late when I got the email, and I frankly was very thrown by this contact so soon, after our breakup had seemed so final and mature and sensible.
And then the very next day, in the afternoon, my phone rang and it was him - but I let it go to voicemail because I was at work. He left a message, which was very brief and a bit awkward, just saying hello and wondering 'if we could talk about stuff'.
It was so vague.
I didn't reply at all... I was reading articles about No Contact, including yours, but it was driving me nuts not knowing if he wanted to talk because he was just lonely and feeling sorry for himself, and working next door to me and thinking we should be able to just be friends, or if he was rethinking the breakup.
So I finally, two nights after his email, sent a reply email. It was very matter-of-fact, just saying 'Why do you want to talk now? We talked a lot last Wednesday? What more do you need to say?' Then I asked him not to call me that night if he got the email straightaway, because I was tired after a long day at work.
He didn't reply or phone, and the next day I was a bit worried that I'd not seemed breezy and friendly enough, so I sent a follow up, thus:
"Well, I feel much better after a good sleep last night and a sleep in this morning.
What was it you wanted to talk to me about?
If you just want to catch up and chat as friends, I have to remind you that I told you last Wednesday I don't want that. You broke up with me, it was very definite, and I need time, with no contact, to get on with my life.
I've been quite well this last week, thanks. Busy with work, doing my acting classes, going out with friends and enjoying the warmer weather.
Take care, ____"

So, that was two nights ago. And I've heard NOTHING since.
So I don't know, did I sound too cheerful about getting on with my life without him? Was he about to say he wants to get back together, and I stopped him?!

Or do you think, as I suspect, that the shock of being at the new job, next door to my work, made him feel sorry for himself and want to reach out to me for a familiar 'friend'? Even though I told him I didn't want to be just friends.

OK, I know that was long, but I really really appreciate your wisdom. Thank you so much for all you do for aching hearts around the world.

xxx

From B in Sydney; October 10, 2015 at 5:00 AM
Anonymous said...: This is B from Sydney again. I think, in telling my story, I didn't make my question clear (and now I can't see what I wrote because it is waiting for approval...)

The thing is, after we definitely broke up, I thought that was it and I was starting to move on. I wanted to be No Contact, and I had told him I didn't want to be just friends, that I needed distance and time.

So when I got that email and phone call after a week, saying he wanted to talk, I was confused. You say to ignore any contact unless it's him apologising for making mistakes and wanting to talk to reinstate the relationship. But I'm not 100% sure that's what his message meant. He only asked if we could 'talk soon' 'about stuff'. So for all I know, he was just trying to get me to be his friend, his armchair psychologist, a shoulder to lean on. I wanted to ignore the contact altogether, but thought I should reply, to remind him I don't want to be friends only. It's up to him to prove he wants more than friendship, right?
Only thing is, it think my cheerful and breezy second email about having had a good week maybe gave him the impression I'm happy without him, so now he will just assume it's best to not try to get back together (if that was his reason for the contact). What do you think?
B; October 10, 2015 at 5:17 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @B in Sydney,
"I don't know, did I sound too cheerful about getting on with my life without him?"

Yep - as you SHOULD. This guy is wishy-washy and when someone is like that, they don't get the luxury of coming in and out of your life at will. And when you say you need to be alone, don't be surprised if you're LEFT ALONE. That's the consequence for a decision like that. And to think that someone is going to be destroyed without you is arrogant.

You SHOULD be cheerful about moving forward, because that's what confident women who know what they want do.

He's wishy-washy and doesn't know what he wants. And that's fine - but he needs to work that out on his own, without constantly pulling you in and out of his life and his "issues."

"Was he about to say he wants to get back together, and I stopped him?"

This may sound rude but - who cares? This guy is already signaling, on MANY levels, that he's unreliable, inconsistent, unsure of himself and unsure of what he wants. So even if he was going to say he wants to get back together. . .that doesn't mean that two weeks later he'll still be there or that he'll still feel the same.

And as a woman, when you easily LET a man slip and out of your life constantly like that, without forcing him to PROVE that he's finally ready first before giving into him again. . .all you end up with is a man that takes it for granted that you'll always be there, no matter how poorly he treats you, so he doesn't have to try, he doesn't have to prove himself, he doesn't have to be consistent or reliable - and he can come and go as he pleases. Keeping you on a yo-yo string, yanking you in when he wants, and then reeling you out and letting you loose when he wants.

And I probably don't have to tell you - that type of relationship is NOT healthy, and it WILL damage your self-esteem and self-worth as a woman. You will start to feel "not good enough" and you will begin to question your own value.

NEVER let a man do that to you, or treat you that way.

"Or do you think, as I suspect, that the shock of being at the new job, next door to my work, made him feel sorry for himself and want to reach out to me for a familiar 'friend'?"

I think this guy has a history, and a pattern of being unreliable and inconsistent:

1) "We went out a few times but for one reason or another, it wasn't for long (mostly because he was rather flaky)."

2) "we went out. . .for a few weeks in 2013, but he ended it (for no real reason)"

3) "every few months for TWO YEARS he would email me saying he's sorry he didn't give it more of a go."

4) "he admitted that he's been feeling unsure about me for a while and he just 'couldn't see a future with me'"

5) "admitted he'd had trouble making a decision"

6) "doesnt' think he's ready for a relationship"

7) "HE EMAILED ME ONLY ONE WEEK LATER"

8) "that was two nights ago. And I've heard NOTHING since."

See the pattern here? This guy has a history of being wishy-washy, flakey, and emotionally unavailable "it was always s*x, not 'making love'. . .and he never ever said that he loved me. . .it was the most emotionally mature breakup I've been through."

Cont. . .; October 10, 2015 at 12:40 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: That's because he was never emotionally invested in the first place. I believe that it wasn't so much that he handled the breakup maturely, as it was that it appeared that way because - he has no emotions surrounding the relationship, so to him it's "another day, another breakup" - this is something he does often. And his ability to constantly turn his emotions on and off like a switch signals that he's unable to be truly emotionally invested. He'll only take it so far, and then he hits a "wall" - he's unable to "dive in" fully and completely.

"It's up to him to prove he wants more than friendship, right?"

Absolutely.

"Only thing is, it think my cheerful and breezy second email about having had a good week maybe gave him the impression I'm happy without him, so now he will just assume it's best to not try to get back together. What do you think?"

Well, as I stated above - I honestly think that in this guys case, it doesn't matter whether he wanted to get back together or not. Because making a lousy phone call isn't enough for him to PROVE himself worthy enough for a. . .what - third chance here? And getting back together doesn't mean this guy's going to stick around for more than another few weeks anyway.

So even if he does wanna' talk, and he does want to get back together - he does NOT receive that right away.

It takes more than words and a bunch of sweet talk - it takes ACTIONS that align with those words. So you can meet and talk, but you don't get back together right away after that. Instead, you signal that you're open to the possibility of that, if he proves himself genuine. You will date him and give him a chance to prove himself - but you will NOT commit yourself to him, until he can show that he's genuine about committing himself to you. And the way a man does that is through repeated, consistent ACTIONS over a long length of time. So until that time, you will continue moving forward with your life, dating him (no sex) and dating others (no sex) as well. And you will not jump right back into bed with him. He's got to start from scratch, and he's got to "court" you and in doing so, he's got to prove himself consistent and reliable. And he has to emotionally invest in the relationship, which for you means - you do NOT commit yourself to this man, until HE commits HIMSELF to YOU. If he cannot tell you he loves you, and if he does not feel love for you - then he gives you no reason to commit yourself to him.

Commitment is a two-way street. . .he gets a commitment from you, when he gives a commitment TO you. It's not just about not seeing other people, it's about not leaving your heart open to other people as well. If his heart isn't with you, then you don't give him yours. This is how you protect yourself from investing too much into someone that isn't doing the same for you in return. You get what you give, and when you give very little, you get very little in return.

I wouldn't beat myself up and place the onus of this situation onto my shoulders if I were you. Because the reality here is that this is not about what YOU did or did not do, or what YOU did or did not say. This is about HIM - and HIS ISSUES. So you leave the burden of this on HIS shoulders, and you shake it off of yours. Nothing you do or say is going to have any real affect on him and his issues. The only thing that will have an affect on that is HIM WORKING THROUGH THEM - on his own. Don't take his "stuff" on as yours.

Cont. . .; October 10, 2015 at 12:40 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: You're fine. You're balanced. You're able to emotionally invest. You know what you want. You're independent. You're confident. You don't need him to take care of you. You don't need him to validate you as a woman. You're emotionally stable. And you're able to stand on your own two feet and move on if need be. That's a well-adjusted human being.

HE, on the other hand, is not fine. He is not balanced. He is not able to emotionally invest. He does not know what he wants. He's not necessarily independent (or he wouldn't be constantly pulling you back in). He's not confident (he's unsure of himself). He's "needy" (he was just trying to get me to be. . .his armchair psychologist, a shoulder to lean on). He's not emotionally stable (he's wishy-washy). And he appears unable to stand on his own two feet and move forward if need be. That is not a well-adjusted human being.

So don't beat yourself up over this, and don't question yourself - you're not the cause of this.; October 10, 2015 at 12:41 PM
Betty said...: Dear Mirror,
B from Sydney here. Thank you so much for your quick and thoughtful response, it is much appreciated!

Upon rereading my story and your reply, I'd just like to clarify that I wasn't always as stable as I sound now, with hindsight!

Two years ago when he and I went out, I say he ended things 'for no real reason' because he gave no reason other than 'I think you're great but I just can't do the romantic thing with you.' But I didn't mention that I was very anxious at the time. I had him on a pedestal in my mind - I was intimidated by his good looks, his artiness, his living in a fancier area. And I thought I wasn't 'enough' - cosmopolitan enough, arty enough, etc. So I was always trying to be cool and the best version of myself, therefore not really relaxed. I think that contributed to the weird vibe.; October 10, 2015 at 2:23 PM
Betty said...: But this time round, I was much more relaxed and confident in myself. Not always 100% (still slightly intimidated). But even though i was more myself, I know I held back from speaking up when I was unsure of things. I guess i was taking more of a passive role in the relationship, waiting for him to lead it.

In part that was because I didn't want to suggest going out a lot, or making too many plans, because I was being considerate of him being in between jobs and needing to reign in the spending for a while. I thought that's why we'd not continued talking about travel plans. (But I didn't ASK).

Also, when I felt a weird vibe about his potentially waning interest in me and the relationship, I assumed he's just in a funk about work and having an uncertain future, or had had a boring day, so I didn't want to 'talk'. We didn't spend huge amounts of time together and given it was relatively early days, I was more intent on just having a nice time in his company. (Though most of the time I realise I was just slotting into his life. I'd be doing my own thing on the lounge - knitting or reading on the internet or watching TV while he looked up stuff on the internet or was in the kitchen preparing a meal.)

So, I just wanted to point out that I wasn't blameless in that I wasn't being 100% upfront when I felt unsure of things. And I was too keen to believe that little things were signs of his commitment - like giving me a key, introducing me to family, talking about travel.

You say he was never emotionally invested but I think he was - just not enough. I believe he was genuine in his affections, he was caring and considerate and always polite. But towards the end I did feel like that's just who he is, a friendly guy who cared about me, but who could possibly take me or leave me as a partner.

You also say I shouldn't give him another chance without proof of commitment. I guess I am at a loss to know what constitutes that proof, when so much of what I experienced felt like that! Texting every day, calling to ask how my day was, spending a couple of nights a week together where he would prepare a lovely meal, giving me leftovers to take the next day, coming to meet my family, buying me an expensive birthday present... They seemed like signs of commitment. If they're not, what is?!

B from Sydney; October 10, 2015 at 2:23 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror, thank you again for your wonderful articles. I've been reading some more and what I'm learning has made me shocked - I am now so aware that a lot of my relationship problems in the past were probably a result of these things:

1. Me pursuing too much
2. Me being too available - ie not providing enough of a challenge
3. Sleeping with someone too soon (2nd or 3rd date)
4. Unconsciously changing once we were exclusive - being too available, ie no challenge, and wanting to progress things quickly. For far too long I've envied coupled-up friends with their well established relationships.. And I've been so keen to stop living in share house situations that I think I have this unspoken pressure to a boyfriend that "I want to move in with you".

Thanks to you, Mirror, I am going to be so different in the future! I just have to forgive myself and not keep wondering 'what if I'd been better' about my past 😔
-- B from Sydney; October 11, 2015 at 8:41 AM
Unknown said...: I have been dating the same man for 3 years the last time we went out on a date was september 21,2015 the next day after that he was off but busy. I have needed him to do little things for me and he never has time.He is a traveling Physicians assistant anyway every sunday is what he calls family day he told me real late at night, "he was working and trying to get home soon" I texted him the next day to ask if he was off and he said "yes but my mother is in the hospital. I have to go see her" this was the second week his mom had been in the hospital that I hadn't seen him. I asked him if she was do better and he told me "she is a little better I think.I will get back to you tomorrow. I'm not sure when I'm going to see you my mom is sick." So on october 4th it was family day and his mom was out of the hospital; 3 days later he texted me and said this "I should have let you know from the start. Not looking for anything serious. Just dating." I felt so stupid because I believed we were in a relationship.Even so I told him "We are only dating. I know its nothing serious." He responded "Ok Cool" I then asked, "Can we go on a date sometime in the future?" He said, Yes when I get a few days off work. I'm not sure when"
Two days later he texted and said "Hey whats up man what are you doing?" After reading that I said man? to myself. 30 minutes later he said, "Hey Shannon how are you?" I said I am alright how are you? He said not bad. Have to be up early in the morning" I told him you should get sleep. He said back to me I know.

Do you think I should activate the 30 days no contact. what should I do? I have never met his parents cause they are arabic and he told me they would talk bad so I never pushed. Any advice?; October 11, 2015 at 11:10 AM
Lottie said...: @B from Sydney.

I feel your pain. Ms Mirror is so right. It's absolutely nothing to do with you. As Ms Mirror says "you are not the cause of this". As much as it is hard to hear, when those words sink in you will wonder why you ever wasted your good time and emotional energy on him.

I went through something similar and I was going to post about it this weekend and then I read your post and knew I had to write. I'll gather my thoughts and will begin my next post.

Take care
Best Wishes Lottie x; October 11, 2015 at 11:22 AM
Lottie said...: Hi Ms Mirror,

I didn't think I would be writing this. So after 2 years of the Doc leaving me as road kill, I get a call from him at the beginning of the week. I just stare at my phone, indifferently. It rings again, I do not answer. I'm totally unfazed.

The next day I then get a call from a number I do not recognise and I answer it and am caught quite off guard by the voice that I am hearing which is his.

He says that he understands 'If I want to hang up on him" - He asks how I am and I say that I am very happy.

He then goes into some pre rehearsed speech about how he has not been able to stop thinking about me.
He told me that he was seeing someone and that it had ended and she was not the person he thought she was. I was so not surprised at what I was hearing.

I thought he suffered from Narcissistic personality disorder - and the more I had read [in great depth, including works by a renowned psychologist] I was more than sure as ever. In fact he could be catergorised as NPD - Overt.

When I figured this out a year later after we had split I had sent him a message wishing him happy christmas. It was a little manipulative on my behalf, I had purposely wanted to open up the channels of communication.

I really had wanted to get him to realise what he suffered from and that he should never be able to date or be with a woman and to get help. Unfortunately the deep rootedness of this personality disorder means you could never really tell them what they are suffering from. They need to take the first steps.

They cause so much pain and I just couldn't bear the thought of another person having to go through this. Anyway he told me that he was seeing someone and that it was not appropriate to keep in contact. I wished him will and left it.

So anyway he talked I stayed quiet, and he said we could meet for a coffee or a 100 coffees. He explained how his relationship fell apart, I wasn't really listening and could not make sense of the thread to be honest.

Anyway I told him I was really happy and that I was only one of a number of women for him. He said that that was not true and that he had never ever contacted anyone he had broken up with before.

Ms Mirror that was because I had amicably walked away without screaming and shouting [I must have known on some level that it was not worth it and there was something bigger to it]

I told him he had a series of broken relationships and that he needed to understand why and that he should not date for a very long time. He asked me what I saw in him [i.e the reason for the recurring messes]. He knew he was troubled, I can't imagine anyone not pointing it out to him [he works in the medical profession after all] I told him it was up to him to find out.

Anyway as I bid him goodbye and I wished him all the care in the world, he whispered to me "don't go, don't do…….don't go" Like a child.

Ms Mirror I am pretty well informed and even that tugged at my heart strings.
But my head said that this was another manipulation tactic and not a real call for help. I put the phone down. He continued to call and I blocked his number in the end.; October 11, 2015 at 12:51 PM
Lottie said...: Ms Mirror I am pretty well informed and even that tugged at my heart strings.
But my head said that this was another manipulation tactic and not a real call for help. I put the phone down. He continued to call and I blocked his number in the end.

I include some further information on NPD - Covert

"An area of psychology massively under catered for: both a thorough understanding and analysis of covert narcissistic personality disorder and covert exploitative tactics and specifically how to treat the type of devastating long term complex trauma and damage to an individuals psyche this kind of invisible abuse can cause.

Covert Narcissists dangle their vulnerability in front of you as bait, just waiting for your good nurturing mothering/fathering instincts to kick in and rescue the poor little lost child they are presenting to you.
As soon as you reach out a helping hand, their jaws snap shut on you.

We fall for the projected idealised image of the person the covert narcissist wishes they could be but knows in their hearts they are not. This is the person they NEED to convince others they are in order to foster narcissistic supply."

Anyway, two years on as I have said before, life is very different for me now.

It is a very sad situation indeed, especially as I have a better understanding of how a person can become like this. I can't help him. I hope one day more work is done in this area.

What an epic journey Ms mirror. One of self introspection, healing, learning and self realisation.

Thank you for all your help and pointing out the obvious when we just make excuses for people and give them the benefit of the doubt.

Lottie x; October 11, 2015 at 12:54 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @B from Sydney,
"They seemed like signs of commitment. If they're not, what is?!"

". . .do NOT commit yourself to this man, until HE commits HIMSELF to YOU. If he cannot tell you he loves you, and if he does not feel love for you - then he gives you no reason to commit yourself to him."; October 12, 2015 at 9:42 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Lottie,
Be proud of yourself - because what you did, requires REAL STRENGTH. And as many on the journey learn, being strong is not easy, it requires real work, and real change - that starts with you. You did the work here, you did your part on your behalf, to protect yourself from "round 2" with this man - by changing your behavior and your reaction to his manipulation tactics.

I realize some of the things I say often seem harsh to many women. But the truth is, life is harsh, dating is harsh - and if you're not, you'll get gobbled up by those that are out to victimize others. At times in life, the emotions need set aside, and logic needs to prevail. And this was one of those times for you, and you handled it well.

I realize he seemed very desperate - and he was. He's probably lost the thing that fulfilled his "need" - a woman. He no longer has that constant injection or "boost" he needs that's provided by a significant other in his life. And upon that realization, he dredged up the past and ended up contacting you to see if you'd be willing to take on that role (to foster narcissistic supply).

"So after 2 years of the Doc leaving me as road kill, I get a call from him at the beginning of the week."

LOL - 2 years. . .and it appears that he still won't go away ;-); October 12, 2015 at 10:22 AM
Piscesgirl said...: 2 years!?!??! Doc rolls back around after 2 years!!!i remembered you writing about him Lottie that is just crazy !!!!!and this is why some women myself included find it hard to move on because there is always that possibility that they will return..but Lottie im glad you recognized it for what it was- a narcissistic man child seeking attention and validation from you (narcissistic supply) after another woman left him heartbroken. Everything Mirror wrote about in Disappearing Reappearing Man applies here. He is an emotionally damaged man and probably had some traumatic experiences growing up but he probably hides it well and is able to get a lot of women because he is good looking or looks good on paper with his professional designation and education but then women realize what is below the surface and the smart ones like yourself realize that you are better off without him. I dated a NPD manchild and one thing I read regarding this personality type that really stuck with me when I was finding it hard to move on is that the other woman he left you for may have won him but what did she win really?? he will eventually use and discard her or if she is smart she will walk away first because he is selfish and self centered and sees women as objects -narcissistic supply that are there to meet his needs. That is a deeply flawed and troubled man who will never change. Society probably praises him which keeps him arrogant but deep inside he is just a fragile broken man who is just like you said still a little boy. Fortunately you grew but he never will. Best of Luck to you Lottie and im glad you find Mirror to help you along this journey xoxo; October 12, 2015 at 12:03 PM
Gem50 said...: @ Lottie, I remember a bit about your doc story. The picture you describe of putting the phone down while he whispered "don't go..." is so very clear. Thank you for sharing the example of strength.

@Ms. Mirror, You did a unscientific survey ages ago asking women how many men have reappeared after disappearing -- I think it was 90% or so. Lottie's doc reappearing after two years makes me shake my head (another one doing a reappearing act) and wonder if women also pop back into an ex's life years after ending a relationship.

I never have, and don't recall any girlfriends saying they were/had contacted an ex. What do you think?; October 12, 2015 at 4:12 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Moa,

This is Rose 88 - thank you for your reply to my first message.

So I tried to follow what you said or at least I tried to maintain the mindset of observation. He got in touch some days before his parents left to ask me how I am etc and I responded kindly in the beginning but then a few hours later in the heat of the moment I added another message as he had his phone switched and still hadn't received my reply which really got me irritated. I added that I am curious to know what it is he does with his parents that demands his phone to be switched off since the day they came. He replied saying he has been touring them around London and switched his internet connection off - not his phone - in order to save battery. He said he really wants to see me when they leave and he has a lot to tell but he wonders whether I want to see him again since I seem angry. I responded that it remains to be seen because he has confused me with his behaviour and left me in the dark. And that I expected that we would start dating properly once his parents leave but I question whether that really will happen with his elusiveness. He said he really does want to see me etc etc.

At some point I broke out into an attack again (can't remember the trigger it might have been part of the same conversation) and I said have nothing more to say and only when he is available to talk face to face should he get in touch and then I will see IF I want to see him. After that he said give me a time and place and I will be there (before his parents left) and I said he should get in touch after they have gone to arrange. From then on he was texting a lot over the following days and we met up. Again there was a confrontation from my part because he was keen to start being physical and I had to confront him again first as I still felt angry. He gave all the right answers and the night went really well and before I knew it we were together again.

(Continued...); October 12, 2015 at 5:45 PM
Anonymous said...: (Continued...Rose88)

After that we didn't stop being in contact (talking on the phone too) and the following day we met again and I stayed at his house and left a day later. We had an amazing time and we realized that we have lots in common and our conversations were endless. That was 2 days ago. We texted yesterday again when I sent him a message to ask him if he felt better because he had fallen sick the day before. However....as part of our conversation he texted at some point quite late at night and I had switched off my phone to sleep. I replied this morning commenting on what he said and also adding that its my first day today at work on a big project and I said I hope he has luck with his jobs today. He read it and didn't respond. I thought its ok since I kind of just responded to his last nights message and didn't ask him anything. But it hurt that he didn't respond with a good morning back and didn't ask me later on how the project went.

Its late at night and I still have no message from him. On Wednesday he starts a new job and I have to talk to him tomorrow as I cant not wish him good luck PLUS it will be TOO long without hearing his voice and talking. HOWEVER it really upsets me that he hasnt taken the initiative to text me today. I wish he would call also but he told me he hates phone conversations. I am worried that we won't develop long term daily communication as it seems that if I hadn't texted him yesterday he may not have done anything. I want a serious relationship and I can say I have fallen in love with him now and I am so anxious....My friend told me that it is really bad that he never commented back on my reply today and it is really bad to go for a whole day without contact if you are supposed to be in a relationship. What do I do MoA? Is it possible he is thinking we should take it slow? Is that feasible though considering we met months ago (but had lots of obstacles in seeing each other intensely)?

Thank you!

Rose88; October 12, 2015 at 5:46 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Gem50,
"I never have, and don't recall any girlfriends saying they were/had contacted an ex. What do you think?"

I'm with you there - can't think of a situation where that was ever the case. I'm sure it happens, but just how often it happens, I'm not sure of. My guess however, would be that it doesn't happen often.

Because women, as we all know and can see here, have a tendency to be very forgiving, to make excuses for bad behavior, to clean up the others "messes" and sweep them under the rug, to grant the benefit of doubt, often - and generally put up with a lot of shit for lack of a better term LOL.

And I think that because women will tend to stick around, and go through so much, before deciding to walk - that when they walk. . .it's over and there is no turning back for most. Because once you distance yourself from the situation, nine times out of ten you're coming out of a fog and asking yourself, "What the hell did I do that for?" And the further you distance yourself from the situation, the stronger you feel towards continued forward motion.

Overall, generally speaking, I think it's these tendencies that probably result in lower numbers of a reappearing women, versus a reappearing man.

But hey boys - yea, you know who you are and you know you're here listening - share with us. Ever had a reappearing woman in your life?; October 13, 2015 at 8:52 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Rose88,
I stand by my original suggestion - I fell that putting the brakes on and pulling back is necessary if this man is not making you happy or fulfilling your needs.; October 13, 2015 at 9:04 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Shannon,
"Do you think I should activate the 30 days no contact. what should I do?"

If you don't want to casually date, and you're expecting a committed relationship to come from this, then you should walk away from this man because he's already told you that he does not want a relationship. When you agree to casually date a man (irregular, sporadic), you cannot expect committed relationship type communication from him (regular, consistent), and you can't expect to see him regularly either.

You've agreed to casually date him, and that's what he's doing here. As a result, you will only see and hear from him sporadically from time to time. If that is not what you want, then you should walk away from him to find a man that wants what you want, and that desires a relationship.; October 13, 2015 at 9:10 AM
loretta said...: @Rose88 - I'm happy that your strategy worked for now, better than if you followed mine! I think this guy has shown he is interested, but you may have to give him some time. Back off, focus on something else, stop initiating contact. He needs to be the one to initiate pretty much all the time from this time on.

As MoA advises, let him chase you. You have now, out of hormones and fear, started to press the issue again, and while he responded to the idea of perhaps not seeing you again, once he got you where he wanted you, he started to slack off. That's what they do every time. It takes enormous patience, which most women under age 40 don't have. Sorry! I remember being 25, 30, 35, it was like the world was coming to an end if I didn't get what I wanted.

It won't. If you can be patient, if you can be more nonchalant (even if you have to FAKE IT), you will be happier with the outcome. I think this man has potential, and I'm glad you didn't blow him off yet. However, he needs to work harder to keep making you want HIM! Don't think you need to make him want YOU. That's the secret.; October 13, 2015 at 9:10 AM
loretta said...: Now for an update on my "love" life. I told you about the guy who wanted a "sofa date" after we had a Saturday night date where he didn't get what he wanted. I passed on his request for me to come over there on Sunday. Then, I didn't hear from him again until Friday morning, when I got a little text telling me a good band was playing at the club near his house. I responded a couple hours later with "I'm busy." Then he texted, "Is that a no?" And I responded a couple hours later with, "Sorry. I have plans." I actually did have plans, but even if I didn't, I wasn't going to jump on a last minute request.

The next day, Saturday, he texted me again late morning and said he didn't have any plans that night, if I was interested. Now, this really ticked me off. So I thought about it for awhile and decided I was going to tell him how that made me feel. I texted back that his style of communicating with me made me feel like an afterthought. And that it was a terrible feeling and I would like to think I was more valuable than that.

He texted back an apology, making this lame excuse that he was out of practice. Which was ridiculous. And I said so. At that point, he asked me if I wanted to go to a concert downtown that night, which would have required my dealing with parking, traffic, crowds. Blah. I said only if you send a limo.

Then he came back with "we will work something out." Which I didn't respond to. Three hours later, he came back with, "How do I get back in your good graces?" To which I responded a little while later with the idea that I'd like to see a new movie at the theater near my house, and I gave him the show times. He responded right away with SURE! And he offered to meet me there. I said, "No. You can pick me up." So, he came to my house, picked me up, took me to the movies, took me out for a little dinner, and dropped me off with a goodnight kiss, like a proper freaking date like the old days! It was great fun, and it put him in his place.

And if he wants to have some of my precious, precious time, he can be a gentleman.

Moral of the story: ask for what you want. If they give it to you, be good company and encourage him. If they don't, move on.; October 13, 2015 at 9:21 AM
Anonymous said...: @Ms Mirror,

I have this DM whom I'm in no contact with, I feel it is definitely the right thing to do 100%. The problem is I've got into the habit of checking his twitter even though I'm not on it myself his account is not private. I've had periods whereby I've stopped checking but then restarted. It bothers me because I realise that it's like an addiction as when I don't do it, I'm tempted to have a quick peek but I realise also that it could be stopping me from moving on completely and I want to.

I've not checked for a week now... but other than don't do it and just distract yourself I still have this compulsion even though there's nothing to be gained from doing it and maybe counterproductive to me moving on completely?

Could you let me know what your perspective on it? I guess my goal is I want to lose the feeling of compulsion to check it and forget about it/him completely, do you think it will go away? and if I'm honest at the moment it's a struggle not to do it - I hope I don't sound too pathetic lol.

thank you!; October 13, 2015 at 11:55 AM
sunshine30 said...: Hi Mirror and Girls,

I want to say I had a man reappear on day 12 that I went no contact on. At first is was him telling me how he stood up for me to defend my name in a work situation (I no longer work there as I moved away). I didn't respond. Late that night, I get a text (we are in different time zones) that says " I can see this is the silent treatment and I will respect that." No response from me. The next day I get the apology, which is then when I respond. However, just because they apologize, doesn't always mean they want a relationship and I want to warn you all to keep this in mind, as it's very important to observe their actions after like MOA says.

We were long distance. We started dating just before I moved across the country. Dated for a few months. He came to my state and asked to meet my parents. A month after returning to his home he told me he wasn't sure he was "ready", but didn't want to lose me. I said, "Well, I'm gonna free you up so you can figure out what you want, if in the future you would like to rekindle this you can reach out; if I'm available maybe we can talk at that time". I then went silent.

He re-appeared 12 days later. After the re-appearance, he didn't want to call, only text. It was casual and different than before. Before he would call me every day, tell me his feelings, etc. I could tell there was a shift. It felt like he was "e-maintaining" me, and trying to get me to admit feelings for him while he went along and did whatever he wanted without committing. I played it cool. I was busy and going out and doing things. He took notice.

A couple of weeks of this went by, and I decided this man wasn't making me happy. He was blowing up my phone by text but not getting real with me. He already told me he didn't want a relationship, and his actions were indicating that. I ended it by saying, "I think it's best we part ways, and as I said before, if in the future you want a relationship, feel free to reach out, and if I'm still single, maybe we can talk at that time. I wish you the best"

What did he say? He came up with all this B.S. that he had fallen for me and should have told me, he wanted a relationship with me but I was the one moving on like I could care less!!!! I said, well, if you are serious about what you said, gimme a call tomorrow. He said, ok I'll call you tomorrow. As you might guess, I never got that call. That was two weeks ago.

I was upset at first that I felt like I had been played, but I'm extremely proud that I sniffed this man out, because his actions weren't aligning with his words. And you know what? I did some digging on him and I found out some information. He was separated and going through a divorce and I dug up the records for the court system for that state-he never filed, and neither did she. The sucker is still married when he told me his divorce was finalized last month. I know I shouldn't have gotten involved with a separated man and will never do so again. He chased me hard and interjected himself into my social circle because we had mutual friends. I of course, fell for it. But it was a lesson learned. This man is a liar, and when a man lies like that..he's dead to me.

Mirror, thank you for all that you do here. I've been a student of yours for 3 years, and while I haven't met my match, the woman I am today is a ton stronger than the woman who would cry 3 years ago when a man disappeared on me (which brought me to your site).

Ladies, don't believe words. Watch for actions and forward momentum. Love to you all...stay strong.; October 13, 2015 at 11:59 AM
Lottie said...: Thanks Ms Mirror - Yes 2 years on and nearly 7 years after the clairvoyant predicted his appearance.

Absolutely, he was after his fix of Narcissistic supply. The interesting thing for me was that he knew that something was wrong with him. But I doubt he would ever seek help.

@Pisces Girl - Crazy isn't it. 2 years on. Yes I was fortunate to figure it out and it was on Ms Mirror's site that I saw NPD and looked into it further. It is particularly difficult to move on from these men as they leave you hanging purposely and you just think what just happened here? And they are masters at manipulating. Oh boy,
So yes they make you feel as if they will come back and that they still really like you. It is positively, positively twisted.

Yes, you are right it all stems from childhood trauma and he most certainly is a damaged man. Unfortunately though he is disguised as a successful doctor and portrays himself as extremely religious. What hope does an unsuspecting female have? - Which is why Ms Mirror's words about 'Actions aligning with words' is so important. Look at a mans actions above anything.

Just goes to show they come in all shapes and sizes. Thanks PiscesGirl. Good luck to you too. x

@Gem50 - Thanks Gem - Yes it took a lot to put the phone down. I just kept a cool head and separated my emotions, which he did a fantastic job of provoking.

Onwards and upwards hey Ms Mirror. xxx

Lottie x; October 13, 2015 at 12:39 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror. I am deeply depressed and could really use your help. I’m 42/Sag. He’s 45/Aqua. I was 4 years celibate when I met him while working a temp job last year. I was instantly attracted to him and heard that he was saying he was drawn to me too. He finally asked me out and we went to the beach in September of last year. He asked me to stay the night, but I went home.

I thought he’d ask for a second date, but he didn’t. He slow faded then disappeared a few days later. I didn’t handle it very well and texted not everyone was meant to be and simply saying so was better than doing this. I changed my number the same day because I didn’t want to look for his call anymore. I don’t know why this man has affected me so. But he has. He was home on vacation that week and I went to my home state a few days later. When I got back, he came straight at me but I would not talk to him from October until December. He kept trying and eventually I gave him my new # in January.

We talked about dating but I’d just lost my home and wanted to situate myself first. I told him it wasn’t a good time but maybe in a few weeks. We still talked while I got back on my feet. He disappeared again in February saying that he was going to charge his phone and would call right back. I told him I’d just talk to him later, but he insisted on calling me right back. He never did and I immediately went nc. He said good morning the next day but I kept walking. He kept trying but I would not say a word until April when I started speaking back. He called a few weeks later but didn’t leave a vm. We still talked on the job but he didn’t reach out via out via phone again until he texted Happy Mother’s Day in May. I called him the next day to say thank you and got off the phone. He called again a few days later and asked why I stopped talking and I told him. He said he’d gone out and that it was too late to call when he got in. I said keeping your word was very important to me and he agreed to do so while asking me to talk to him instead of just shutting down.

We kept talking and in July, I accepted an offer for him to cook for me. He’s an excellent cook and I stayed letting my heart rule instead of my head. He started bringing me lunch after that and telling me about his day. He said he missed and wanted to see me but did not ask me out again so I pulled back. I got a permanent job and left a few weeks later. He kept trying to get me back to his house, so in August I texted that things happen in life, but any man I chose to continue sleeping with had to treat me well/remain a gentleman and asked if he would do this. He didn’t respond so the next day I texted that being w/him was a beautiful experience but that I couldn’t see him anymore. I said I was sorry this didn’t work out, wished him well and that was it.; October 13, 2015 at 2:16 PM
Anonymous said...: Cont.
I fell apart but felt a lil empowered at not having allowed him to use and then discard me at his will. I was slowly feeling better when he started calling 3 days later. He didn’t leave a vm until a week later asking me to call him. I finally decided to a few days later and he was happy to hear from me. He said “you finally called” as if he couldn’t believe it. I said I was on break at work and just wanted to touch base and got off the phone. He called the next night but when I saw he still wouldn’t ask me out, I got off the phone.

In September, I went out with my bff and he called when I got home. I was drunk and felt like talking sh*t to him so I did. He said he liked that side of me. I told him that I wasn’t about to discuss dating w/any man. That I’d never had that problem before and was too old for it now. He said he didn’t have a problem dating me but I know actions speak louder than words. A few weeks ago, he again asked me to come over and I told him that I was going to a bbq. He didn’t like that and said I was putting it over him and that I needed to come see him or stay home. We were joking during the call and I thought he was kidding but I am not so sure now. He surprised me by calling as soon as I hit the door and telling me how he felt about me. He said he cared about me and loved the way I walked, talked and laughed. He said he loved my spirit and the way I treated people. He remembered things from the night we spent together that I had totally forgotten. He’s never said he cared about me or used the word love before. He begged me to let him come over but I would not do it.

Last week Sunday, he called and I told him I was going to a baby shower and would call when I got back. I called and got no answer. I tried again later and same thing. I haven’t called back and neither has he. That was the only time I’ve ever called him twice like that and will never do that again. It’s been 9 days now and he hasn’t called. I’m not bouncing back as I did before. It seems my sadness is getting worse and I would really value your advice, wisdom and guidance in this mirror. Thank you so very much in advance. pinksag; October 13, 2015 at 2:17 PM
Gem50 said...: @Rose88,
I'll apologize in advance but my response to your explanation of recent events is opposite to Loretta's (my apologies Loretta).

When I read your last message, I heard you stating you acted out your anger on the man you reference. I also heard in your message that his reaction was to give you what you were demanding. But it didn't last long. You said he has POOF'd and now you need to hear his voice.

What I read is your description of forcing your will on to this man and him complying initially. But now you, nor the relationship, are on solid ground.

Ms. Mirror's advice is shown here to be accurate in so many instances. And as good as she and her advice is, there is something equally valuable to learn: letting go. Letting go of other people's lives and their choices. Letting go of thinking people are here to please us. Letting go of thinking we have any right to dictate people's behavior. We don't.

We are all responsible for ourselves. We all have a right to set expectations of how people treat us; and if we don't like it, then we move on. That is living in strength. Lottie showed it in her message of hanging up the phone. She didn't tell doc what was wrong with him, she didn't tell him what she expected from him, she didn't tell him what she needed from him. Lottie made a choice and walked away leaving the doc to figure his stuff out for himself if he chooses to or not.

Ms. Mirror has stated time and time again, wait until HE asks for information. Wait until he apologizes. If you don't wait, you are doing the heavy lifting for him and the relationship.

I am not saying this is easy... it isn't. I've been practicing it for a couple years... and sometimes it still rips me apart when my needs are not being met by another, but I remind myself that they are not here for me, they are here for them.

There is plenty of what I call Magic in the world -- and you can switch the word Magic with anything you like -- it's just a word. I use the word not as hocus-pocus stuff, I call it Magic because I think it's a pretty word and you can't explain it with Science or logic or black/white sense. When you meet someone and you know them in your soul, when you have a feeling about something and it happens, when you try something for the first time and it's like you've been doing it forever, etc. You can't explain any of it. For me, that's Magic.

Take care of yourself and let Magic arrive within your relationships.

I hope this makes sense.

@Ms. Mirror, I do hope some men give their feedback on female disappearing/reappearing acts. It's purely unscientific and I'm just curious. lol Your thoughts make sense and certainly applies to me when I finally get to the "over" point: there's no turning back. p.s. I never heard back from the guy I met for morning coffee. PHEW! So glad I didn't have to go through that ;-); October 13, 2015 at 7:05 PM
loretta said...: @Gem50 - no apologies necessary! I think we are in agreement about what is going on with Rose, and we have the same philosophy about how to let go. I do, however, think there is something pervasive in our culture that tells us to quit, let go, move on, "swipe" a little quicker than is necessary. I don't like to give up too easily unless the situation/job/romance is really bad early on. I think we need to nurture things a little and let people come into their area of comfort. Sometimes a good guy will appear like a jerk at first, but then he grows a little and starts acting like a caring person. I see it all the time. There are some obvious deal-breakers that you can't overlook, but I don't think the time it takes for a guy to respond to a text or a phone call is one of them. It's too arbitrary.

I also think that Rose has a chance with this guy if she plays it cool, reels in her expectations and just enjoys the dating aspect. The author of "He's Just Not That Into You" wrote another book called, "It's Just A F** Date!" and goes into all the things that happen on dates, and how you enjoy them rather than worry about them.

I don't get paid for these endorsements! HA! I wish. Anyway, that's something to look at.; October 14, 2015 at 12:29 PM
loretta said...: As far as returning to old boyfriends, I have never gone back to an old boyfriend. I had an on-again-off-again relationship once in the 90s, and I never had anything go on during the separations. However, I never went back to an old boyfriend if I had begun to see someone else (or after a couple months regardless.)

Now, I know Casual Guy reconnected with two women from his past. I know the first one was her idea (and they were sort of friends already for a long time) and that didn't work out. Then he got together with another ex that didn't work, either. I think both women realized that things either had not improved (which is why they stopped dating before), or they had not improved (if he did the exiting.) Hard to say.

I am with most here who realize after breaking up and getting on with my life that I would never date that person again and wonder what I ever saw in him in the first place! One of the guys I dated for 10 months in 2013-14 married the next girl he met. Ouch! haha; October 14, 2015 at 12:35 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Rose88, Gem50 and Loretta,
Great discussions gals - and valid points all the way around.

Rose88, I just think that when a pattern of bad behavior or poor treatment starts happening in a relationship (i.e. more than once and with patterned regularity) -- AND/OR your OWN behavior or bad habits start to become uncontrollable and begin take on a repetitive pattern of regularity, inflicting damage onto relationship -- it's time to pull back, put on the brakes, take a breather and regroup.

Because if you keep moving forward without doing so, you will repeat mistakes of the past and risk the relationship for good. And if HE doesn't do the same, and take some time and space to "check in" with his own feelings, emotions and behavior, again the relationship itself is at risk for the long term.

In otherwords, if people are exhibiting patterns of self-defeating behavior in a relationship (one or both), and they do not pull back and each address their own issues - the relationship is doomed and will likely ultimately be short lived. Pounding a square peg into a round hole is an effort that's doomed to fail. It's much wiser to stop pounding, remove the peg, shave off the corners causing the blockage, and rework the peg to make it round so it fits with greater ease.

If he is not forced to experience some distance for his treatment of you - he'll continue to do it, if you continue to accept it. And if he continues to do this, and you do not take some time and space to let your emotions balance and try to find healthy ways to control them (rather than act on them), you'll continue to react the same way - and you both will be stuck in self-defeating repetitive cycles of behavior.

If this is to work, someone has to break the chain - and by break the chain I mean - change their behavior.

He must either be forced to think about his own behavior himself by experiencing a break in this, or you must force a break in this onto yourself so that you can take time to think about your reaction to his behavior, and whether or not this man even appears as someone willing or capable of making you happy. In this case, I think a break for both would be healthy, but that's just my opinion. The other option is to continue forward, never addressing his behavior or your reactions, and experiencing the same cycle of dysfunction over and over again until the relationship blows up and has no chance of a future at all.

It's clear that there's a communication issue here, and that each is blaming the other most likely. And we all know that you cannot control others - so it's wise to focus on what you CAN control - which is yourself, and your reactions. And in order for that to be fully addressed without doing further damage, time and space to do so is most likely probably necessary.; October 14, 2015 at 1:02 PM
Gem50 said...: @Loretta,
I think you hit the crux with the word "quit." What or who are we quitting when we say to ourselves, "No, this person is not contributing to happiness in my life, rather this person's behavior is bringing me sadness," and instead of taking a step back, we move towards them with our wants, needs and anger? When we do this, I think we quit ourselves.

When we take a step back, I am not suggesting we throw someone away. I am suggesting that we stop being engaged. Instead, we take a breath, take time, and take care of ourselves.

I believe 100% in Ms. Mirror's message for women: do not express negative emotions when dating. And part of that is due to the cost of the emotions. Or put another way: Your paying a high price up front for something you don't know has any value long term. Why do that to yourself? To get your immediate needs met? Well, yes maybe, but as we become more of an immediate-fix culture, there is a huge loss to our internal growth. As a tree is one of many contributing to the health of a forest, I can only imagine how each of us individually are contributing to society as a whole -- and I include myself in that question as well.

Once we can truly let go of the expectation that others should fill our needs, it is freeing and amazing and rolls into every other part of our lives.

When we step towards things that are not contributing happiness to our lives, we are quitting our growth, our potential, ourselves. hen we expect others to fill our needs, we are placing the burden of our growth on to them, and our happiness is dependent upon their actions, their needs, their choices -- that's not what we are here for.

@Rose, you can get to a place where you will be able to recognize your feelings as they are and handle them in a way that takes care of YOU first -- without anger and without need. It isn't easy, but it's worth it dear. You and your future you are worth it dear. Keep reading and keep practicing.

And Loretta, something made me think of the lawyer tonight before writing this, and the thought that you should keep your eyes open around you -- whether it's around town or in a newspaper. I still have a feeling you are going to learn something and it's going to be an AHA!

(Hugs to all); October 14, 2015 at 6:39 PM
Gem50 said...: p.s. @Ms. Mirror, You are so very good at getting a message across in a wonderful way... I admire that.; October 14, 2015 at 6:50 PM
Fire&Water said...: @Loretta @Gem50: thank you both for sharing your stories and wisdom and learnings and trials and errors and thought processes. They demonstrate so many nuances of relationships and ways of thinking about and approaching situations, which are valuable!

Like this : "ask for what you want. If they give it to you, be good company and encourage him. If they don't, move on." - that's a good thought/way of handling things to keep in mind. I read these comments and try to file them away as potential ways to handle situations when I encounter them,

And this "I think we need to nurture things a little and let people come into their area of comfort. Sometimes a good guy will appear like a jerk at first, but then he grows a little and starts acting like a caring person."

This is a great premise to keep in mind too. I think because people fit a bit differently with each new person, so you have to take some time and observe who they really are (Mirror's principle of observation, essentially): are they the jerk they came off as at first, or, once they get to know us, are they their better self?

I agree w/ Loretta & Gem - I don't like to throw people away too easily. Sometimes, what we have to determine is how far back we have to stand to not let them go/send them good will, but without hurting ourselves at all. Sometimes we can stay close, and sometimes we have to stand way way back...like on Mars ;)

There's a bit of the Drowning Swimmer principle involved here. (For anyone who hasn't heard this scenario, I'll share it because it's a great metaphor for a tough lesson: if you are trying to save someone who is drowning and possibly injured and you are coming up to rocks and have a chnace to be thrown against them, whose body do you put closest to the rocks - yours or the drowning/injured person? The answer is that you put their body toward the rocks, because you can't help them if you're injured. You have to protect yourself first to have any hope of doing good for someone else.)

"She didn't tell doc what was wrong with him" -This made me think of the following: I have in the past, when the opportunity arose, told an ex I have dumped what he did that caused me to do so. I think there are two huge caveats to doing that: 1) you have to be completely emotionally disengaged from the person. You can't care whether they listen or not and you can't have any illusions about them changing for you and 2) you have to do it with good intentions in your heart,. It has to come from a true desire to possibly offer help to someone, but without any attachement to the outcome at all. And you can't have even a trace of anger, resentment or any negative feeling left toward the person. I don't actively look for those opportunities. I simply mentally arrange what I might say and then put the thought out to the universe that if I am supposed to say it, to please let the opportunity arise. I guess when we're emotionally invested, we show strength by saying nothing. If we're not emotionally invested, sometimes it shows strength to say something.

"One of the guys I dated for 10 months in 2013-14 married the next girl he met. Ouch! haha"

LOL -this has happened to me three times :) ...although the period I dated each of the guys was much shorter. As an interesting aside, this group includes the fellow I described above, that I gave unsoliciated advice to :)

For posterity: "As far as returning to old boyfriends, I have never gone back to an old boyfriend. I had an on-again-off-again relationship once in the 90s, and I never had anything go on during the separations. However, I never went back to an old boyfriend if I had begun to see someone else" - this is true for me too.; October 15, 2015 at 9:37 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Oct 13, 11:55 AM,
"Could you let me know what your perspective on it? I guess my goal is I want to lose the feeling of compulsion to check it and forget about it/him completely, do you think it will go away?"

You don't sound pathetic, this is a very normal, human thing to experience.

And while there is no magic fix, it helps to be realistic about where that "need" or compulsion comes from. And the reality is that it stems from a bit of insecurity, and the need to receive validation from those that reject us - so that we feel valuable.

So it might help, when you're feeling compelled to do this, to stop and not take any action for 10 minutes. Do not let the compulsion control your actions. Instead, use the mind to place 10 minutes between the compulsion and any action taken.

And then during those 10 minutes, reflect on the reality and ask yourself, "Do I really need this man to validate me? Will it really make me feel better? And if I peek at his Twitter feed, what value does that bring to me? Will it make me feel better or worse?"

And really take the time to think those things through. You may still decide to take action. But at least you're programming your brain to stop and think first. And in doing so repeatedly, eventually you may get to the point where the mind is able to take over and control the compulsion.

Laser focus and control of the mind is a very valuable thing - and taking the time to think things through before taking action is also a very valuable skill. If you can practice that and hone it to perfection for yourself, you will find that this skill comes in handy in more areas of your life besides romantic ones as well ;-); October 15, 2015 at 10:30 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @PinkSag,
Well, I don't know what to say other than - you did a great job handling this one. And that takes real strength, so you should commend yourself for that. You didn't let this man use you, or walk all over you.

But at this point, I'd have to say that I think he's running out of chances here. He's already had several and each time, all he's proved is that he's unreliable, inconsistent and flaky about what he wants. He says one thing, but then turns around and does something entirely different.

And when a man's words do not align with his actions - it's a big red flag.

He says he cares, but then he disappears. He says he loves the way you treat people, but then he "said I needed to come see him or stay home" instead of attending a BBQ. He loves the way you treat people, but then he wants to tell you how you should treat him LOL ;-)

It's been a year now - and NOTHING has changed.

His behavior is still the same, he's proved that his words mean nothing, and he's disappeared repeatedly and failed to follow through and call/return calls repeatedly as well. I'm sorry but this man just doesn't strike me as someone worth investing much more time into :-( He's had an entire year to make something happen already, yet he's done nothing and there's been no real progress made.

And that's not your fault. He's the one disappearing first. He's the one saying he'll call, but then not following through. He's the one who charges after you, gets you where he wants you, then flakes out on you.

It's possible to date a man like this if you know how to handle him, which you've already proved you're capable of - but it's generally not ENJOYABLE to date a man like this. So if I were you, I'd maybe sit down and create a list with two columns: one that says "Good Things I Get From This" and another that says "Bad Things I Get From This."

And then proceed to list things that apply to each, under the correct column. We know that under the bad column would be "Bad Things I Get From This Are 1) Anxiety 2) Worry 3) Distraction 4) Blown Off by Him 5) Disrespected by Him 6) Ignored by Him.

And under the "Good Things I Get From This 1) He Cooked for Me 2) Sometimes He Says He Misses Me 3) . . ."

See which column fills up faster, and then step back and take a look at the "big picture" and take stock of what, if anything, YOU are getting out of this situation that's positive. If the short list ends up being the "good things" list. . .then you have your answer ;-); October 15, 2015 at 5:25 PM
Anonymous said...: @ Ms Mirror

Thank you for your reply re: checking his twitter

It's funny but since posting I feel the compulsion has weakened a bit, but then again I do flip flop, so your tips about what to do sound great I'm going to print it off for any moments of weakness.

I'm kind of thinking too that I'm going to try and not check for at least a month, like the no contact in a way and see how I feel then but you're right it is about a need and I think it's because I've been really burnt out and suffer with low energy, it makes you feel not good about yourself sometimes. So with the twitter thing I suppose it's like a quick fix and me looking for something outside of myself to make me feel better. But you're right it makes me feel worse and even though I'm non-active on twitter it still feels like a bit of an attachment and not letting go. It's so hard the process of letting go but I think like you say by focusing on changing my behaviour, being in control of it and reflecting on it, it will make me stronger and then letting go might become easier as time goes on.

I think the need is also about the need to have an emotional connection with him but anything social media is not a REAL connection and just an illusion and again this reflects to me looking outside myself instead of within. Plus I've not got any evidence (actions) to say the least that this man is capable of emotional connection. So for me not checking his twitter is like cutting a tie, as I feel that he's kept me hanging purposely with his disappearing acts but I believe it is my responsibility to not hang on to this guy and cut all ties and i suppose the not checking twitter is something that I can control my own behaviour and I'm feeling that as the days go by I've feeling more empowered and less controlled by the habit.

...and focus is an area that recently has come into my awareness that I struggle with and need to develop and perhaps do some more learning around.

but all in all I feel much better and hopeful that I will be able to break free of it and let go. Thank you your help is so invaluable!; October 16, 2015 at 2:14 PM
loretta said...: This really belongs in the "Disappearing Man" thread, but since I started the story here, I'll continue it. I told you about my date last Saturday with the "New Beau" who texted me on Friday morning and Saturday morning last week to initiate a date. I turned him down until he agreed to come out here and take me to a movie and dinner. We had a very old-fashioned date. I had a nice time.

Guess what? He fell off the radar. He didn't contact me in any way all week (nor I he, but I don't initiate contact at all at this early stage), and no texts on Fri or Sat either. I guess he disappeared! Perhaps he is looking for someone easier, someone who will drop everything to see him at the last minute, or drive out to his part of town, or give in easily. I noticed, of course, and I was a little surprised, but I am not at all feeling rejected or sad about it. If my standards are too high, no problem!

Meanwhile, I've been reading about "attachment styles" and have discovered some interesting things about my past relationships. I have a pretty secure style except when some "avoidant" guy triggers my insecurities. I get a handle on that pretty quickly - I'm older, less insecure, and don't need their validation anymore. However, I think a few of my previous beaus were avoidant types. Avoidant types usually attract anxious types (who obsess and are clingy with them), but they occasionally attract a secure person who tries to fix them! What a pain. I don't want to volunteer for that anymore, especially since I know I'll never really be fulfilled. Why settle?

Most guys in the dating pool are anxious or avoidant. All these guys that disappear? Avoidants!

Casual Guy is a classic "avoidant" type, although he's not dismissive and he's not angry or aggressive ever. He's not a narcissist, he's just an avoidant drunk. A common combination. I'm not sure it can ever be any good, as I mentioned many times he is the world's worst boyfriend. He is, however, improving in some ways, probably because he saw that I will walk away from him for real. He doesn't want to have a serious relationship, but he doesn't want to lose me, either.

He cancelled our writing meeting (again), and I can live with that right now because I'm so crazy busy. But if he does it again, I'll have to postpone any further scheduling until he gets organized. He wants to start a new business arrangement with me, and I gave him a list of things I need before I can come onboard. I'm in no hurry, so if he never gets around to it, I'm not going to nag him. He will benefit from that arrangement, so he can do the footwork necessary to get it going. I'm not going to remind him like a 15-yr old kid.

I already have a 15-yr old kid I have to remind to do everything. That's enough work.; October 17, 2015 at 5:17 PM
Anonymous said...: Thanks for the advice MoA :-)

So you and my brother and my fears were right.... He maintained contact by texting the last few days (still no phone call) and made no suggestion to go out. I CANT BELIEVE IT. I just cant get my head around the fact that last week we 'got back together' and were so close and romantic and he told me that he told his parents about me and I saw his new house etc.... and the week that followed (meaning this week that has just finished) he didn't suggest seeing me, he only texted his usual hey, how are you? blah blah...boring texts and then the weekend came and all I got was a text yesterday afternoon saying hey, how are you and then I replied (very formally and shortly to be distant) and he replied in the evening just telling me 'I'm good too, just got back home, been a long day as I have gone back to working on the project all day'. I thought to myself COME ON its a Saturday night and you tell me this and you don't even mention us seeing each other at some point!! Also the previous evening when I mentioned I was going out with some friends and he should join us he replied by saying he's too tired but we should catch up soon (!!!). CATCH UP SOON?? How am I supposed to take that? Who is he texting - a colleague??

Going back to last night's texting....so he sent me that message saying he'd been working until then and I didn't reply at all - that was that. I had nothing to say and honestly I don't know whether he's even telling the truth. I just can't believe how disappointing things have turned out and how opposite they are to the words and behaviour he showed last week when we were together. I don't know what happened....whether I did sth to change his mind and he lost interest all of a sudden...or whether he never had enough interest to begin with.

The point is that I met this guy when he was head deep in this project with a deadline approaching in one month and so for the entire first month and a half I was super patient with him...dating once a week....not protesting when he would wake up and rush out at 8am....not protesting when I would only get texts and no phone calls...not protesting that I strictly got to see him only once a week and that often arranged last minute. What kept me hooked was the chemistry I thought we had and the belief that he really did want to dive into this with me once his deadline would be over. Now that the deadline passed and I see that it was all a lie....MAN is this a slap on the face. I feel hurt and a fool above all. I really did go out of my way for this guy and spent hours listening to him constantly talking about this project. What did I get in the end? This. And I don't know what the best route is now. He may never text again in which case that's that. But if he does I don't see anything that can change my mind now - how can I trust him again after this? I wonder whether I should just text him and tell him its over so I have the last say in this or just leave it and if he texts just never reply.

P.S: Sth worth noting - when I was at his house last weekend he got a message from his flatmate who was away at the time and in the message he was laughing and saying 'so she's actually at our house now?'. That did strike me as weird at the time but I chose to turn a blind eye but now when I think about it and also the fact that he was quite defensive in explaining it to me (because the message popped on the screen in front of me) so it does seem quite suspicious now....

Rose88; October 18, 2015 at 6:17 PM
Gem50 said...: @Rose88,
"The point is... " taking care of yourself for the long haul. You are the only one who can see what that looks like.

To your comment, "... so I have the last say in this..." Who says you will by texting "it's over"? If you truly want the last "say," in a way he will hear if he thinks about it, is to go silent if he does contact you. There are plenty of examples throughout Ms. Mirror's blog that show this is true... plenty. And plenty of examples of these men circling around weeks, months, years later -- unscientifically told on this site these men reappear 90% of the time.

Practice what you are reading here.; October 20, 2015 at 7:07 AM
loretta said...: Hi again - this belongs also on the DM/RM thread, but I figured my 3 followers (lol) might look here for an update. Ok, I had a Reappearing Man! After 18 months, I heard back from a guy I dated briefly in May 2014, at the same time I met Casual Guy. He was a nice enough person, and we had some fun, but I could tell he wanted only the most casual of relationships and I was meeting other men, so I told him Seeya! He reappeared a few days ago, and we picked up the conversation. I was going to get with him after work tonight (Fri), but he reaffirmed that he was still not interested in anything serious. I told him I had no time for that, and I was going to look for something more substantial. We all are not at that place in our life, and it's ok. But I saw no point in even entertaining him.

A year or so ago, I would have gone out with him again, out of boredom or curiosity, but these days I value my time a lot more.

Meanwhile, Casual Guy made both meetings this week and we finished Act 1 of screenplay #2. It's moving along at a nice pace. I give him more time than anyone, even my friends, but it's for a cause. haha. He has been very attentive, occasionally flirtatious, and solid in the showing up department. So progress!; October 23, 2015 at 7:29 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi. this is something that happened about two months ago and I'm still trying to make sense of it. I would be interested in your opinion (s). So My DM says to me that I do things that make him unconfortable (like hug and kiss him). (Nevermind that I've taken all my cues on that from him--let's put it this way--if you wanted to get his fingerprints, all you'd have to do is process me.). I found it curious that he told me this one week before the mother of his child was coming into town for a BBQ, that I would also be attending. Ok. So at the BBQ, I see him and I just waved and said hi. What does he do? he Kisses me and says hi (note, the other woman hadn't gotten there yet). His daughter and her mother show up along with his little grandson. I had gotten something for the baby a week ago. He tells his daughter that I got something for the baby she said thank you and I said you're welcome. and that should have been the end of it. Well, later that night, I see that there is a message on my phone from his number. I listen to it and it's the daughter (again) thanking me for the gift. (not sure why she didn't just get my number from him and call me from her phone). I did not return the call because 1. I was in the middle of NC with him and didn't want to speak to him and 2. I didn't feel the call needed a response. So a week later, leaves me a voice message asking if I got the message from his daughter. again, I did not respond. then a week after that, he sends me a text message asking the same thing. The text was full of frustration (hee hee). so about three days later I answered it. my answer was very flat and to the point. I didn't say hello or ask how he was. He did not respond to my response. That was two months ago. the other day he sends me a text saying Hello. He hasn't seen or heard from me in two months and all he can say is "Hello"?? How about "I haven't seen you or heard from you in a while. are you ok?" I tell ya.; October 27, 2015 at 9:03 AM
Anon7 said...: Hello,

So my situation is a little complicated, to say the least. This guy and I have been together for the last year and a half. I'm a single mother, and he's 5 years younger than I am. We started hanging out after seeing each other around with mutual friends. Everything has been amazing, he is great with my son and treats me well also. Lately things have been rocky, as we talk about future wants, Etc. I want to eventually have kids and be married within the next 5-10 years, whereas he is focused mainly on his career and success.

We ended things mutually, with no hard feelings. We've consideres ourselves to be each others soul mates as we have never been so close and one with anybody before.

The break up only lasted a few days, because I had the "genius" idea that we can be best friends since we both have each other's best interest at heart and would never hurt each other. (Genius, right?) wrong. After a week or two of "friendship" he was making comments like "I don't want to hurt you, can you handle just being friends" and all the other nonsense. I kept it really kosher, and said that I wasn't here to get in his way of anything or anyone. I'm assuming this led him to looking through my phone and reading an innocent text thread with a guy who has had a crush on me. (I have zero interest in him)

That night he started acting weird, but didn't mention anything was bothering him. After calling him the next day, I was blocked off of his phone and every other social media network. I called him out on it, and all he said is that i didn't deserve an explanation. Obviously, me knowing what happened, I brought up the texts. He immediately flipped out and said he wanted nothing to do with me and wanted to erase anything that has ever happened.

I haven't called or texted him since, today being 2 weeks exactly.; November 15, 2015 at 10:15 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Mirror, desperately need ur advice.
Was dating a guy for 3 months as friends. After 3 months he asked me to be his girlfriend of which he said he was serious. He knew that I have just (7 mths) ago broke up with my ex after a 5 year rs and told me he will be there for me to pull me out of the dark sea. After a month of being together he sudd became cold and stopped contacting me for 3-4 days. But to be fair when i msg him, he did reply so he did not entirely MIA-ed. I asked him why was he acting so strangely and he suddenly "accused" me that
1) I take him as a rebound (I didnt say it)
2) I wanted to get back together with my ex. (I didnt say it)
3) He has not put his heart into any rs hes in

He was clearly disrrespecting me n the rs and so I broke up w him immediately. After 2 weeks he msged me and ask me how am I and was I back with my ex. Of which I replied NO. Den after another 2 weeks he msged me something random that I had mentioned to him in the past of which i didnt reply. I think he got paranoid that I blocked him on watsapp and emailed me repeating the exact same question. Now it has been 2.5 weeks aft his last msg.
What can u make out of all this? Did i make the right decision?; November 17, 2015 at 9:25 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Nov 17, 9:25 PM,
"What can u make out of all this?"

Sounds as if he's insecure:

http://www.aphroditeastrology.com/2015/02/insecure-men-dating.html

It appears he feels he's not good enough for whatever reason, and as such, he's assuming that you'll return to your ex (because he's a better man). And rather than just admit he was struggling with this, he took to making accusations instead.

"Did i make the right decision?"

If he admitted his heart isn't in it - then absolutely. Additionally, he'll need to work through his insecurities on his own. If he lacks confidence as a man, there won't be much you can do to change that.; November 18, 2015 at 9:02 AM
Anonymous said...: From @Anonymous Nov 17, 9:25 PM
Tks Mirror for ur quick response. U have no idea how grateful I am.
Anyway another quick qn - Should I use no contact here? Meaning if he msg me shld I juz ignore?; November 19, 2015 at 2:13 AM
Anonymous said...: Hello Mirror, I hope all is well with you and yours. I haven't written in some time now as, with your kind, sensible guidance, I was able to get beyond my disappearing man several years ago.

At this time I've got a new issue. I've gone no contact with my on/off again "boyfriend" of 2+ years. I have broken things off with him twice now, once for 9 months and now for nearly 6 months. He's extremely persistent and wants to start fresh and start seeing each other again. I've told him dozens of times that we both need to move forward. Finally, 15 days ago I went no contact as, although not a stalker, he's very persistent. How many times can I say no? I added his number to reject/spam in my calls and messaging but his text messages are still getting through. I have ignored him and haven't answered even one of his texts. Now he just says "Hello, I miss you." or "Hello beautiful." Sheesh! I do care about him and have always valued our friendship and wished we were able to continue our friendship after the romance ended but that wasn't to be as he just wouldn't let it rest. He is a lot younger than I am, emotionally selfish, stubborn, stuck in his ways, and inexperienced with women. I feel I am not here to teach this man child the ways of women, romance, and love. That is why I finally broke it off with him once and for all in early June as I became irritated with his unintentional yet annoying thoughtlessness and inexperience and felt that, in reality, our romance had no future. On the other hand, he is kind, respectful, independent, sweet, reliable, and a good listener/friend without any addictive habits (other than persistent texting haha). Will he eventually stop contacting me and move on? Where did I go wrong? I feel that if I reiterate on the fact that we broke up (in June) and are moving on it will just open the floodgates once more. I'm so confused. I feel I'm being cruel to him but I know of no other way to move ahead and am trying to also help him move on by ending contact. Thanks for any insight you may have MOA, hope your weekend is wonderful.

Astrid; November 21, 2015 at 1:24 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Astrid,
"Will he eventually stop contacting me and move on?"

Well it doesn't sound like he understands what's taken place, his youth may be clouding that, and he's unable to see that the age difference means there probably is no future here (emotionally, you're at two very different stages of growth). As a result, it appears he's unwilling to participate in a friendship and instead, keeps pushing for more of the same (something romantic).

If you respond to that, he'll most likely misinterpret it as "interest" on that level (a romantic level). Which really only leaves you with once choice - to force the space yourself, as you've done.

"Where did I go wrong?"

It's not that you're wrong, so much as it may be the fact that you want to hold onto this belief that "friends" after lovers is possible. In 90% of situations - it's NOT possible. One of the two generally secretly wants more, and when they don't get it, resentment builds. And then it's only a matter of time before that causes the individual to act out on it. Either by refusing to accept the situation as it is and attempting to force something romantic into being once again, or by eventually reverting to some nasty words or vengeful behavior.

It takes two mature adults to pull off a friendship after romantic involvement.

And you've stated he displayed "thoughtlessness and inexperience" and "emotionally selfish" - and this is his youth. We've all been there. While he doesn't intend to be immature, the reality is that he is due to his age and the emotional stage in life he's in. Which means he's most likely going to be incapable of understanding all of this and navigating through his emotions on a level mature enough to be able to participate in a friendship.

That's not your fault, and it's not his - it's simply the reality of the way things are unfortunately.

It's probably best to continue the forced NC - for both him and yourself - so that things can level off a bit. You don't want to string him along or give him the wrong impression, which means you can't respond to these inquiries. If you do, as I stated previously, he's going to interpret that as romantic interest on your part. You've already given this situation two chances and it didn't work. There's a reason that things don't work, so stay the course you're on and eventually, I believe all of this will subside.; November 22, 2015 at 9:09 AM
Anonymous said...: Hi Mirror,

Love the blog and am currently using no contact to detach from a man who 'dumped' me after dating for 3 months. Wanted to get your advice on how I should best move on and learn from this miserable experience so as not to encounter the same things in the future and actually have a healthy relationship.

I met a guy online over the summer and had a series of fun dates. We made out at month 2, and, as a virgin at the time, I felt ashamed after the act as he's the closest I ever got with a guy. I told him I wanted to take my time as I did not want a dating experience just about sex...and didn't have any real dating and/or sexual experiences to begin with. He said he wanted to mention that he didn't want a relationship so I relaxed a bit, and we kept hanging out on a more sporadic basis. I thought I could just be a friend and perhaps it could grow into something more at a much later date as we got to know each other, but we kept making out...and ultimately did the deed a few weeks ago. His behavior definitely changed a bit after he told me that he didn't want a relationship, and he seemed very conflicted/ambivalent. I told him that I couldn't continue having sex casually and would have preferred doing so in a committed relationship (and understood that wasn't what he wanted right now), he was well aware of my virginity, and he said he understood but "we could still chill as friends, but let's give it a couple of weeks." I had no idea what he meant by this at the time and got caught up in family issues, but realized that he wanted to keep giving it (sex) a try.

Remembering that he said something about a series of parties a few weeks ago after I asked if we could hang out in public places going forward, we touched base and he asked me what I was up to on a Friday. I looked at it as an opportunity to establish a friendship and to just have fun without the pressures of sex. Another event came up, I let him know, he seemed disappointed, I made it clear that I could still meet with him, and waited for a response. The day of our supposed meet-up, he texted that he wanted to be friends and felt like I still wanted a relationship. Even the text itself was ambivalent, but the idea of being friends and not wanting to meet was very clear. I didn't know what to say to this, as it was the first time he ever blew me off for anything, and I felt like my willingness to accommodate him contributed to this ('nice' behavior tends to invite poor treatment from others). I didn't respond to his text because it seemed to me that he was looking at this meetup as an opportunity to hook up (biggest clue being that we never established any concrete plans) despite my wish not to. Its been over three weeks since the last communication, and I'm safely assuming that his communication about being friends is "being civil if we see each other in the street" so I don't expect that we can be friends or hang out again nor do I expect either one of us to be in touch. He's gone and whatever we shared (wasn't a relationship) is over..

While looking at the experience as a lesson learned, I just want more advice on how to detach and re-establish some self-esteem and dignity after the fact. It hurts to keep ruminating over this situation given my former circumstances, its rather hard to move forward despite really trying, and the damage has been done because I think his impression of me is so low right now. I don't regret the good times we shared at all--I just wish I had more experience to know what could have been going on through his mind :-(; November 23, 2015 at 6:37 PM
Anonymous said...: Hello, Mirror. I have to say you're amazing. I feel like you can see so clearly and easily where most of us struggle to find meaning. That's why I would really appreciate your help.

I was in a long-distance relationship for 4 years, he broke up with me 12 days ago. For the last couple of months we fought all the time, I felt like he wasn't respecting me so I ended up being clingy and needy and angry with him all the time. Only after the break up I realized why I was mad at him - over the years he often talked about his ex gf (his first love), he used to compare me to her (mostly when I was emotional, implying she was "stronger" than me, they were perfect for each other, etc.), and about 2 years into our relationship I found out he was checking her facebook DAILY, sometimes MULTIPLE TIMES a day. We got into a fight, he deactivated his facebook, but couple of months later I found out he was googling her name all the time. I felt betrayed and emotionally cheated on. He kept saying he was over her (they broke up 6 years before we started dating!) but it just scarred me, I felt like she was better in every way. He once told me she was the prettiest girl he's ever been with so that's why he's facebook stalking her. In no way through his actions did he show anything less but complete devotion to me, he never disappeared, we talked several times a day, exchanged text all day, chatting, gaming, he was simply the best boyfriend I ever had and I loved him to pieces. I tried to put all of that ex stuff behind me and not mind because it was THE ONLY thing not working for us. But I became so insecure and obsessed with his obsession. I just wanted to feel like I'm enough for him, but never did. He said she was his first love and they were on and off for 3 years but it was special and he'll never forget her. He told me that ever since her he never thought he'd be happy again but I made him believe in love again and I should take it as a huge compliment.
Long story short - I became unhappy with all that stuff and in turn made him very unhappy. He broke up with me, saying he loved me but he can't see a future with me anymore, we weren't compatible, he's thought about it for 3 months and was sure of his decision. Only after the break up did I realize that maybe I was overreacting? That was the only thing bothering me. Was I just too insecure? Again, his ACTIONS didn't show anything short of loving me and being completely devoted, but casually bringing her up, comparing us, stalking her.... that got to me really bad. I felt like #2 in his life. I'm a mess, on one hand I feel the break up is what's best for me, on the other - maybe he was just idolizing her but loved me completely? Am I being petty and obsessive?? I tend to be that way in life. No man is perfect, and there was almost nothing else for me to complain about.

Ever since the break up (over the phone) we haven't spoken/texted/anything. He said it's best not to contact so it would be easier on both of us. While breaking up I got overly upset and I yelled at him and was pretty mean but I didn't beg or plead, we just kind of... hung up on each other. It was as painful as it gets. I'm afraid of losing him if I don't contact him, we're long distance so he will bounce off pretty fast and get used to a new life without travelling to see me... Please help me. I feel like I don't know what I want from life/myself/him, and that indecision is KILLING me. Am I overreacting about this ex thing or is it something worth breaking up about? Thank you! - Julia; November 24, 2015 at 1:12 PM
Anonymous said...: P.S. What would you suggest I do? I feel like we ended things on a very bad note and yet the relationship was wonderful. I feel like travelling to his town and asking him to talk, at least have one last face-to-face conversation and closure. But I'm afraid it would backfire. Should I wait for him to contact me or act until it's too late? Thank you...; November 24, 2015 at 1:16 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Nov 23, 6:37 PM,
"I looked at it as an opportunity to establish a friendship and to just have fun without the pressures of sex."

Once you've had sex with a man, he's never going to revert back to friendship only (no sex). So if you're dating a man that has already told you he doesn't want a relationship, but signals he wants to continue receiving sex, and you are not comfortable with that - it's best to not continue seeing him. Otherwise, if you do, you will be repeatedly placing yourself into a compromising position where you can be pressured into providing regular sex, even though that's not what you want.

"I just wish I had more experience to know what could have been going on through his mind"

Well, he already shared that with you - he doesn't want a relationship is all. And that's not a reflection on you, it's simply his wish for where he's at in his life right now. So you can't look at the experience as one of "rejection" because he didn't reject you - he had sex with you. He is just not looking to become involved in a commitment.

"I think his impression of me is so low right now"

His impression isn't low, again, it simply goes back to the fact that he doesn't want a relationship, and he senses that you do. So rather than continue to string you along, he's showing respect by breaking it off. Which is the right thing to do - because you both want different things. He could continue to see you and attempt to pressure you for sex, but he's doing the right thing by choosing not to do that.

There's no magic pill to fix these sort of things. You have to walk through the emotions and it will take time to completely work through them. So you can't expect to feel better overnight. But at the same time, you can't beat yourself up over this either. It's not your fault that you both want different things. It's not your fault that he doesn't want a relationship or commitment. You knew that prior to becoming intimate with him, so you already knew where you stood with him and he was honest with you about that. None of that is your fault, it simply means that this was not a match and that you two are at very different stages in life.

So do your best to keep yourself busy, and take time once in a while to work through the emotions, and then get busy again. Participate in life, have fun with girlfriends, take up an old hobby again, and do things that make you feel good and confident - get a new hair color or hair style, refresh your wardrobe or treat yourself to something special. Be kind to yourself and love yourself and keep yourself busy. . .and before you know it, this will start to fade into the past and become less of a concern ;-); November 25, 2015 at 9:05 AM
Anonymous said...: Mirror, thank you for your sage advice, reassurance, and peace of mind that, indeed, I'm taking the right course by continuing NC. Hopefully his texts will taper off so that he's able to move on.

You're absolutely right, that's why I could never get truly angry with him, he was just acting his age! Although I'm flattered to be desired by men so young and handsome I do have a new dating rule. In the future I will not date men <35 years of age no matter how persistently they pursue. I've been approached by several young men since the breakup and have stuck with my guidelines. haha

Yes, I don't want to stir up any vengeful behavior in him as he's a law enforcement officer. Yikes!

Wishing you wonderful holidays.

Astrid

P.S. Have you ever considered creating and live streaming a podcast? I feel you would be wildly popular and successful!; November 25, 2015 at 12:43 PM
Anonymous said...: Hey Mirror! I've been reading your articles on here and they're brilliant! And I've been trying to use the knowledge I've learnt in my recent romantic blunder.

Back in January I met a guy at work and we became a couple pretty quick. We were both 21 back then, now 22 and both Leo's. We get on really well, but because of our type of work (both in the Navy and were on the same ship together that was out at sea back then) we had a couple of problems arise that wouldn't have arisen in normal circumstances, and we split up (he broke up with me and I took it unrealistically well; no crying, begging, nothing! I just said "Yeah, okay." And that was it, but it tore me up inside).

I initiated No Contact immediately (that being very difficult seeing as we worked and lived together, but I managed it). Once we got back home it took around a month before I started noticing his interest in me again (he gave me a 3 1/2 hour lift back to the ship one weekend and I'd noticed him staring at me a lot and getting involved in nights out I was going on, which he never used to do before we got together). I still had feelings for him and so when he asked me out I said yes.

This was just after he had been drafted off the ship, and was around mid July. It was around this time his brother had been in and out of hospital and he told me he really appreciated having me to talk to during this time and that I was one of the few people he felt he could relax around and talk to. I feel as though I may have helped him through it.

Since then we have seen each other roughly once a week (85-90% him making contact via text), however because of our job it's been rather difficult (He's been away on a physically/mentally demanding course and I was sent away with the ship for six weeks). Anyway, after the fourth time we saw each other we started sharing a bed (NO sex, I was good). We also went to Brussels together for the weekend, I have met all his very close friends, and his family (all of whom like me).

Also, I may have been too easy as whenever he asked me to see him I've always been available, and I've also asked to see him a couple of times (really not good, I know!).

So anyway, I feel as though I messed up because I was getting a little anxious as to where this was going; we'd been seeing each other for around four months by that point, but we'd only actually seen each other around six or seven times.

So when I was around his place (he still lives with his parents), I asked him if we were together and he said he didn't know. I was rather upset by this, but I kept it together for the rest of the day until we went to see a musician that evening. He could tell something was up and when we got back home I ended up crying a little bit (not majorly, but my eyes were tearing up a lot). He got me a cup of tea, a tissue and we talked.

Continued...; November 25, 2015 at 4:13 PM
Anonymous said...: He said he's not very experienced at relationships; I was his first and only girlfriend, just like he was my first and only boyfriend, and that he doesn't want it to end like it did last time. He said he was going crazy during and after the breakup last time and that he can't commit to anything. Though I feel these are just excuses - I think I may have scared him off a bit.
I don't know if it matters or not, but we've never had sex because I haven't felt ready (done other things, but not that). But he's always been very understanding and has never demanded anything or pushed me.

He's also been having a really bad time with the Navy; he really wants to leave and even his mother told me she's never seen him behave like this before (he smashed his phone screen - which is very shocking as he's such a laid-back and sweet guy, never gets angry).

I said I felt as though I'd been used. So I ended up asking "Is this it then?" (as in, is this thing over) and he said that we would meet up in two weeks time and talk about whether or not to give it another shot. I agreed and the next day he drove me back home. When we said goodbye he looked so sad and when we hugged he held on to me when I started to finish the hug. Almost made me cry, but I held it together. I honestly think he really cares for me.

It's been 2 1/2 weeks since then and I haven't heard anything from him, I haven't talked to him or seen him either. I began No Contact immediately just like last time, and I can feel myself slowly healing already.
I'd just really like to know if you think he'll be back again? I know he's young and he hasn't had much success with women (given I've been his first girlfriend). If you have the time, I'd just like your take on my situation. Your advice would mean a lot and give me a good insight into what, if anything I should do.

Thank you so much, Mirror!
LittleLeo; November 25, 2015 at 4:13 PM
Anonymous said...: @ Mirror 11/25 at 9:05 AM
Thanks for your kind advice, Mirror. You're right that there's nothing to do now, but to keep moving on and just be happy that things didn't end up worse. I don't know if I'll ever hear from or speak to this guy again, despite hearing from my friends that they all come back in some form (I wouldn't know either way since it hasn't been my experience and we only knew each other briefly). Based on his text, I figured to just leave him alone, detach, and work on myself as opposed to worrying about him. Still remain hopeful that I can meet someone who truly wants the same things and is still a great guy and am very conflicted about online dating so I'll try to just meet people in real life when the time is right. Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours!; November 25, 2015 at 7:17 PM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Julia,
"I became unhappy with all that stuff and in turn made him very unhappy"

Maybe so - but the ENTIRE time he was making you unhappy by constantly triggering your insecurities and comparing you to his ex. And rather than truly "listen" to you, and attempt to respect you and the relationship by keeping those thoughts to himself, instead he continued on with it. And he was not showing any concern for your feelings in doing so. So if he ended up unhappy over the result that HIS OWN actions produced, then that's on him, not you. That could've been quickly rectified had he simply shown a bit of respect for you, the relationship, and your feelings.

"Only after the break up did I realize that maybe I was overreacting?"

No - any woman in that position would feel the same. And any MAN in that position would ALSO feel the same. The biggest mistake anyone, man or woman, can make in a relationship is talking about the ex morning, noon and night. Making comparisons regularly makes it even worse. No one wants to live in
someone else's shadow.

"his ACTIONS didn't show anything short of loving me and being completely devoted"

Well, that's not entirely true. The action of stalking your ex like a crazed admirer for years after a break up and during a relationship with someone new is not showing love and complete devotion to the person you're now with.

"I'm afraid of losing him if I don't contact him, we're long distance so he will bounce off pretty fast and get used to a new life without travelling to see me"

But - if you truly feel that way, isn't that telling you something important that you might be overlooking? If, indeed, this man does easily rebound from this pretty fast and get used to a new life without you. . .what does that tell you? It's validation that you've indeed made the right decision for yourself, because someone who loved you completely and was devoted to you entirely. . .would not be capable of doing that.

Instead, they would be heart broken, and they would struggle with the loss, and they wouldn't even be interested in dating again right away, let alone moving on as if nothing happened.

"I feel like I don't know what I want from life/myself/him, and that indecision is KILLING me."

Might a suggest a simple exercise to help you clarify what you NEED versus what you WANT? Because sometimes what we want is not what we actually need. Sit down with a piece of paper and begin jotting down short lines of things that make you happy and fulfilled. It would look something like this:

1) Security (must feel it in a relationship, must be it in myself, and have it in life financially)
2) Appreciation (received in a relationship, appreciation of myself, and appreciation of others)
3) Respect (received in a relationship, respect for myself, and respect shown to others)
4) Love (felt in a relationship, love of myself, and love for others)
5) Trust (felt in a relationship, trust of myself, and trust give to those who've earned it)

Cont. . .; November 26, 2015 at 10:23 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: And then take a step back and look at that list. Was this man fulfilling all of your needs? Was he making you feel secure in the relationship? Was he respecting you and the relationship? Was he showing an appreciation of you and the relationship? Was he making you feel loved? Was he showing you that you could trust him?

See how sometimes we think we know what's best for us, but then when we break it down we find out that we really don't know? You may feel this man is what was best for you, and that he was making you happy. . .but in truth, it appears he may not have been fulfilling your needs. And instead, he was constantly triggering your insecurities, which triggered a lack of trust (he was being reckless with your feelings and your heart), he was being disrespectful of you and the relationship, he wasn't showing appreciation for you or the relationship (he was taking things for granted), he wasn't doing a good job at making you feel loved, which in turn meant he wasn't doing a good job at making you feel secure.

Having fun with someone and talking to them all the time and enjoying their company, etc. is great. That's important. But these other things that we can't feel and touch with our hands are even MORE important. They're the foundation that a healthy relationship is built on, and if they don't exist or are fractured, the relationship comes tumbling down - either right away, or after years of enduring it.

"yet the relationship was wonderful"

But was it really all that wonderful? Was feeling second best all the time making you happy and leaving you with warm, fuzzy feelings of joy?

"I feel like travelling to his town and asking him to talk, at least have one last face-to-face conversation and closure."

You've received closure, you don't need to put yourself through that again. It's not realistic to expect that a relationship will end with lots of laughs, good vibes, hugs and a civil handshake. Generally that's not how things go, so expecting that will only leave you disappointed because there's a very high likelihood that's not going to happen.

"Should I wait for him to contact me or act until it's too late?"

But - what makes you think that you taking action is going to "fix" things? What makes you think that if you do take action, this is all going to just magically fall into place, he's never going to mention her ever again, and you'll ride off into the sunset together?

Taking action doesn't guarantee anything.

If anything, taking action right now will only bring you face to face with more pain in the form of possible rejection, harsh hurtful words, or ignorant treatment. There's a good chance it will only complicate things further and set you back even farther emotionally. You can't force someone to love you or want to be with you. They have to want the same thing. And if they don't, there's no action in the world that can change that, ya' know?

Cont. . .; November 26, 2015 at 10:25 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: If I were you, I would not reach out to this man and risk further damage to myself emotionally by doing so. Instead, I'd leave things cold, where they are now. . .and I'd see if he starts to miss me.

I'd see if he notices my absence from his life. I'd wait and see if he starts to show signs of regret. I'd wait to see if he feels sorry for his part in this. I wouldn't rush in to try and control and "fix" things. . .I'd sit back and wait to see how broken they really are in the first place. Because if he doesn't miss you, he doesn't feel sorry, he doesn't start to regret his decision and he doesn't feel my absence missing from his life - then he's not a man I want to be with anyway. He's not the RIGHT man for me - because I deserve to be loved and appreciated.; November 26, 2015 at 10:26 AM
Anonymous said...: "He's not the RIGHT man for me - because I deserve to be loved and appreciated." Right on Mirror! Truly! I love reading your site, your words are so inspiring. I realize the above response is for another, but thank you.

Astrid; November 28, 2015 at 2:00 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Little Leo,
"I'd just really like to know if you think he'll be back again?"

Most likely, he will. But he's got to sort himself out if he's to be "ready" for anything else that requires his time and a commitment from him. He's already struggling with the pressure he's feeling from being in the Navy and he's seeking a way out from underneath that. Which means that right now is not the time for him to be placing further pressures on himself in the form of relationship commitments - and he knows that, which is why he's holding off.

While I realize this is painful for you, truthfully, it's the best thing for him to do at this point. Much like I always say on the site regarding women, the best thing he can do right now is take care of himself. Once he does that and gets his situation under control and finds himself in a place where he's happy again and feeling more carefree. . .he will be in a much better position to take on relationship commitments, and he'll be much more open to them as well.

So for right now, just know that his decisions are not a rejection of you - they're a rejection of additional "pressures" at this time is all. When someone is already feeling they're under a ton of pressure, their natural inclination is not to take on any more of them. That's normal and it has nothing to do with you. So try to remain patient, keep living your life and moving forward, and once he gets his own situation under control and in a place where he feels happy again. . .chances are it's at that time that he'll seek you out ;-); November 28, 2015 at 10:31 AM
Anonymous said...: Thank you so much for your patience and insight, it's made me feel a whole lot better. I'm not going to worry about it anymore, I'm going to trust him and trust your advice.
Thanks again for replying :)
LittleLeo; November 29, 2015 at 9:21 AM
Anonymous said...: Mirror, thank you very much. I feel like I knew all of that deep in my heart and my gut, but somehow it got clouded. I was trying SO HARD to let go, not be bothered by it, but it kept eating me away. He did bring out the worst in me, and no amount of conversation can change that, it certainly didn't while we were together. He just kept doing everything he likes, not minding how I felt about it, but rather lying to me straight to my face. That's manipulative and disrespectful. And you're right - I forgot my value and my standards and started changing myself to fit his needs, while he was blind to mine.
You pinpointed exactly everything I feel. I will not contact him. If he's not sorry, he's not worth it. "He's not the RIGHT man for me - because I deserve to be loved and appreciated" - I can finally accept that. Thank you so, so much. <3 - Julia; December 2, 2015 at 5:17 AM
loretta said...: Hi All. I've been keeping up with the new comments, but haven't had time to update you. As usual, Mirror has excellent advice, and it always applies to me either in retrospect or in the present. I value this site very much, and it is a go-to place for every situation!

Since late October, many things have happened in my love life. And let it be said that an old dog CAN learn new tricks! (Me being the old dog!) I have met (online) several prospects that I had to reject after a few phone conversations. I highly recommend talking to someone before you meet in person. I used to just cut to the chase, especially in the summer when it was easy to meet people. No more. I talk to them. You learn a lot when you talk to them. The two prospects I "interviewed" both turned out to be control freaks, and it was definitely not a good match.

However, I did meet a new guy who is very nice, complimentary, attentive enough but not overly so, willing to drive out to my part of town to meet, lives in a gorgeous house in the country (kind of far away, but not the end of the world), and best of all, really treats me well. We all know what it looks like when a man like us for real. When you are unsure, don't even bother with them. It's a lesson I have to learn again, and I think I might finally be ready to let go quicker, instead of trying to win someone over. I don't have to win this new guy over. He likes me already, and it's really obvious. Incidentally, this new beau knows Casual Guy very well. What he told me about him lined up with what I already know, but it did make me realize that CG had a certain personality that didn't work well with anyone, let alone a girlfriend.

Meanwhile, Casual Guy and I finished a draft of our first script and had a group of actors sight read it at a formal reading. It was amazing and very instructive. We have to do a rewrite, but it's really exciting. He took me out for my birthday and was quite nice. But, as is his pattern, he then started to flake out again and things were weird and frustrating. Most of the time I ignore his weird "Come Here, Go Away" games, and just tell him what I want and do it. He usually goes along with whatever I want. But this time, with all the stress I have been under working 6, 7 days a week and having issues with my kids (injuries, illnesses) and a death of a very dear friend, I didn't have the grace and equilibrium to take Casual Guy's actions in stride.

Instead, I let him have it with both barrels. When he blew me off for his birthday (which is right after mine), via text, like a coward, I called him and reamed him a new one in a 20 minute blast that reiterated all the problems we were having as a working partnership and as friends. Never mind the on-again-off-again romance that he flounders in because he doesn't want to have any expectations put on him. The essence of what I told him was that HE is the only person in my life who treats me poorly, and that I don't have to be with people who treat me that way. I am in a place in my life where I can walk away from any situation I don't like. And unless he agrees to a set of conditions upon which I will resume working with him (never mind being his friend), I will not be around anymore.

He hasn't contacted me since this conversation. I am ready to walk away for good.; December 2, 2015 at 9:32 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Loretta,
"He hasn't contacted me since this conversation. I am ready to walk away for good."

That's okay - do what you have to do. You've made yourself clear, and if this is important to him, he'll adjust accordingly to at least meet you halfway. If he doesn't. . .then that says a lot, so listen and proceed accordingly yourself ;-); December 2, 2015 at 4:32 PM
loretta said...: Thanks, Mirror. I thought about what I told him, and it wasn't anything new. This was not an avalanche of pent-up frustrations. I've talked to men in my life/family who tell me they hate it when their gf/wife waits too long to get upset, and just stores things up. This wasn't the case. Every example I gave him was something I had already mentioned several times before that had to do with our work environment (at his house, based on his comfort, not mine), and various ways in which he neglects the simplest requests. It occurred to me that I was actually astonished that I had to bring them up yet again; that he was still so derelict in his attention to these things. I think his drinking has paid a heavy toll on him, and this is the result. I suppose he is humiliated and ashamed by my outburst and my list of expectations. He told me he wanted to live up to my expectations and agreed to everything I asked. But then he went silent again.

We have been working on this screenplay for over a year, and it is very important. It could change both our lives if we broke open with it, along with two others we are writing. I am very confident about it. If I have to finish it alone and do the rest of the work without him, I will. I won't let him sabotage my dreams. He can sabotage his own.

But you're right. I will see what he does. If it's as important to him as he says (both the work and our friendship), he will make the next move. I will now go on Cricket Mode. lol; December 2, 2015 at 10:33 PM
Anonymous said...: Hey Mirror, I love reading your posts, your advice and guidance is spot on. I wonder if you could help with my current situation. I am currently dating a guy I met online (age 32) and I'm 25. We went on 7 dates in the space of 3 weeks and did stuff (not sex). I got a bit of cold feet and broke things off as I didn't hear much from him via texting and thought he wasn't that into me. I began to think he may have been after one thing. When I broke things off, he said he really fancied me and he wanted to get to know me more etc and was basically trying to win me around again. I said let things be and that was that. Anyway, I started to regret my decision and contacted him a month later asking if we could meet up as I was missing and thinking about him a lot. He agreed and we met up. It was a really good date, not weird and he didn't question why I had got back in touch. Only thing was, his parents were in the same pub (hopefully a coincidence!) so I met them! I wasn't sure how much he had told them about us as the father said 'I bet you've been here loads of times' and 'has he told you about this and that' whereas his mother didn't know my name.. We've met up again since and had another good date. The reason I message asking for your advice is I feel confused by the whole situation. He is notoriously rubbish at texting but online a lot on whatsapp- who is he messaging?! I'm one of those people who needs reassurance that the guy is interested as I don't want to waste my time or be lead on. I worry that he could be dating other girls. We've been dating for about 2 months now (including the 3 week break); December 4, 2015 at 12:40 PM
Anonymous said...: Somewhere in this article you imply that Men aren't hurt by breakups and women are capable of super-emotions, that can't be fathomed by a male .
Let me tell you ; I am a man, I know men who have curled up on the couch, near suicidal, for six years, after a wife has left for greener pastures.
Continuously blaming themselves, for all the stupid mistakes they made that must have caused her to have an affair and leave.

The fact is, women are able to turn-off and move-on much quicker than a man.

Also, I don't recommend any woman try the 'no-contact' on a man with any self-respect.
By the time you 're-surface' I will be dating someone else, smarter, younger and prettier.; December 5, 2015 at 8:12 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Dec 5, 8:12 AM,
"Somewhere in this article you imply that Men aren't hurt by breakups and women are capable of super-emotions. . ."

This is simply in reference to the fact that women have a higher emotional intelligence than men. The male and female brains are different. Men are wired to be more logical, while women are wired with more complex emotional capabilities (most likely because of child birth - needing the ability to read emotions when no speech is involved to care for their young properly):

"Men generally have more connections within each hemisphere and between the front and back of the brain.
In women the stronger connections usually run from side to side, between the left and right hemispheres.
In essence, what this means is that men are more logical and better at coordination and spatial awareness. Women are more intuitive, have greater 'emotional intelligence' and better memories for words and faces."

". . .the study, concludes that male brains are geared 'to link perception with doing' - so men would be better at, for example, learning a new sport. Female brains, meanwhile, are configured to handle matters of heart and mind and to study others' behaviour, then interpret it using intuition and analysis."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2518327/Mens-womens-brains-truth-As-research-proves-sexes-brains-ARE-wired-differently-womens-cleverer-ounce-ounce--men-read-female-feelings.html

"Also, I don't recommend any woman try the 'no-contact' on a man with any self-respect. By the time you 're-surface' I will be dating someone else, smarter, younger and prettier."

There are only 3 instances that I suggest that no contact should be used in: When A man suddenly disappears on you, when you want your ex back, to get over a man. That's it.

The first of which deals with something you've mentioned yourself - respect. Particularly self-respect. It's one thing to no longer want to date anyone, but it's an entirely different situation to disappear on them. It's disrespectful. And a woman with any self-respect (as well as a man) does not, and should not, tolerate that type of treatment.

If someone disappears on you without a word, they're disrespecting you. As a result, they don't deserve a response when they circle back around. Instead, they need to feel the consequences of their own behavior, man or woman.

So for just as much as you wouldn't tolerate this type of treatment yourself from a woman, there's no reason a woman should tolerate it from a man either.

Using no contact to get an ex back (or to get her to chase/notice) is actually something that men invented. Just google "ignore her" and you'll see for yourself:

http://www.collegetimes.com/college-life/6-ways-make-ex-want-back/104940

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-raise-an-interest-level-ignore-her.153752/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT0zQxWDXWY&feature=youtu.be

Cont. . .; December 6, 2015 at 10:28 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: http://kennyspuathoughts.com/2015/07/09/ignoring-a-girls-texts-as-a-way-to-raise-your-stock-in-her-eyes/

And using it to get over a man really doesn't need much of an explanation. It simply helps to keep anyone, man or woman, from getting pulled back into something that isn't healthy and/or isn't making them happy.

I don't suggest or advocate using no contact as a game to win someone over. I only suggest employing this tactic is the 3 situations above. I have to admit though, I find it interesting that each time you comment here, you make it a point of mentioning that you're moving onto someone younger, smarter, and prettier. I imagine that works quite well as a "trigger" with insecure women, and you seem to be well versed in that.

The problem with that tactic, however, is that it ONLY WORKS on very insecure women. Which means that those who use it will only attract very insecure women to themselves. They're the only ones who will give in to that and chase or become upset by it.

Confident women don't care what the new woman looks like, what age she is - or how smart she is. They've got other options themselves, they're receiving male attention, and they're wise enough to know that if the new girl is smart. . .chances are she'll leave once the games to take the upper hand begin. And they will begin, because a man who is focused on shallow things such as "smarter, younger, and prettier" all the time, instead of the deeper, more complex things that truly matter - is insecure himself. It's the entire reason he's playing the "trigger insecurities" game by throwing around "younger, prettier, smarter" to gain control in the first place. Confident men don't need to threaten that, or make it a sticking point when moving on, because they're seeking a deeper connection than that with a woman.; December 6, 2015 at 10:28 AM
The Mirror of Aphrodite said...: @Anonymous Dec 4, 12:40 PM,
"The reason I message asking for your advice is I feel confused by the whole situation. He is notoriously rubbish at texting but online a lot on whatsapp- who is he messaging?! I'm one of those people who needs reassurance that the guy is interested as I don't want to waste my time or be lead on. I worry that he could be dating other girls. We've been dating for about 2 months now (including the 3 week break) "

Well - he very well may be dating other women. And unfortunately, at this point he's permitted to do so (as are you). Because there's no commitment here. He has not asked you for one, nor has he agreed to enter into one himself. Which means that this is a "casual" dating situation, and as such, it will not be with any regularity, and it will not come with "relationship" type communication, treatment, etc. just yet.

So at this point, you can either choose to continue dating him casually, while casually (no sex) dating others yourself. . .or you can simply acknowledge that this man isn't making you happy, nor does he appear to be willing to move things to the next level - and move on and away from him. What you can't do is make him love you or want to be with you.

So if dating this man isn't making you happy and instead, is only causing you anxiety and unhappiness - move on. If you think you can continue this way for another 2-3 months, give it a try. But if you do that and come the 4th or 5th month or so and still no change - move on. Because chances are if after that amount of time the man isn't moving things to the next level, he's not going to unfortunately :-(; December 6, 2015 at 10:39 AM
Anonymous said...: "So at this point, you can either choose to continue dating him casually, while casually (no sex) dating others yourself. . .or you can simply acknowledge that this man isn't making you happy, nor does he appear to be willing to move things to the next level - and move on and away from him. What you can't do is make him love you or want to be with you"
Thanks Mirror for taking the time to reply. I want to move things forward (not a relationship yet but have the reassurance that he's not dating anyone else). I'm not dating anyone else, even though I know it's allowed at this stage. I just don't understand why he would agree to see me again after that break if he was keen on another girl but also why he seems to have little interest in contacting me. Before our break, he was really good at organising our next date; at the end of each date, we would have a date in the diary for the next date so the limited texting from him didn't bother me too much then because I know we were going to see each other. It's now been 4 days since our last text, one which I initiated and no date arranged yet for next week.. Tempted to ask him what's going on as I am an impatient Aries but so far resisting!; December 6, 2015 at 11:00 AM
VirgoPal said...: Mirror,

It's been a while, but I need your advice. I met a guy back in July on Tinder who lives in NYC. We've been talking for 4 months and never met up in person but have Skyped and talked on the phone several times. He also has multiple pics of me (fully clothed), I might add. We've had plans in the past to meet up. The first time was not very well thought out because I went to Boston on a whim, and I invited him to meet me there so we could get together and it's actually closer to NY than my hometown. It didn't happen because of the weather. He then tried to arrange a trip to see me that I sort of canceled on him after we got into an argument. After a cool off period, I changed my mind and we were back to talking again. Again we talked about him coming to my hometown, and at the last minute he changed his mind and made an excuse that he wasn't able to make it. I sensed there was doubt in his mind about me, and I called him out on it. He acknowledged that it bothered him that I was likely dating multiple people and assumed I was not as interested in him. I told him I thought it was best if we ceased contact since he was "unsure" about me. Before I hung up the phone on him, he stopped and told me he wanted to make it work and we planned a weekend where he would fly down for a date and to spend time together during the weekend. I told him that he better not back out or I was finished.

Last weekend came and he texted while I was at work that he was going to fly down instead of driving due to travel time. He attempted to plan everything, including the flight and hotel arrangements, at the last minute. The flight cost was enormous, and I let him off the hook because I felt bad given his financial situation, he's a medical student and is currently not working. Well instead of flying due to cost,I proposed he drive down the next day and that was the plan as of last Saturday. The next day he texted me he was not comfortable driving 12 hours round trip and he would book a flight for another date to see me.
He told me he will make it up to me and he really wants to date me,but at this time I feel like his actions are not matching his words. I feel like I deserve a better effort and want to be treated like the great woman that I am and not be at the hands of a lazy dater who doesn't want to pull his weight.

I went no-contact on November 30th mid-conversation because I'm tired of being hurt and disappointed after broken promises and his indecisiveness.Since last Monday he's called me 3 times and texted me multiple times as if he knows I'm reading his messages but ignoring him (ex." miss you" or "have a good night"). I haven't responded to any of his messages and don't plan to at the moment because he really needs to understand that I mean business and will not reward mediocre behavior with more attention which he seems to enjoy from me.He seems to be used to women doing all the work and not being accountable for his actions, but I'm not going to go the extra mile for someone who has never taken me out on a date yet. The only way I think I can reset this "situation" is by pulling back and for him realize how life would be without me for an extended period of time. Am I being harsh for doing no contact for 30 days or should I just make myself less available and make him step up? At this point in time I think 30 days are required because he is such a lazy dater. Anything less than 30 days, I think he will not take me seriously as a person or woman. Mind you, he has never been rude to me or disappeared. I can't wait for your feedback! In the meantime, I'm going to enjoy dating and look for someone else who will step up to the plate.; December 6, 2015 at 11:54 PM

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